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Idle CoreParking vCore // 1700x+X370TaiChi

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VUMeter View Drop Down
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    Posted: 09 Aug 2019 at 7:50pm
Ryzen 1700x
X370 TaiChi BIOS P3.10
Windows 10 Pro x64 v1803

I am using a slightly tweaked Windows Balanced power profile, it's more towards power saving than being responsive ala the "Ryzen Balanced" profile.

Something strange happens with my system regards Core Parking and vCore.

After boot up and stabilisation, at some point seemingly at random, CoreParking gets disabled (cores no longer park as shown in Task Manager) and both RyzenMaster and HWiNFO show SV12 TFN jump from the usual idle 0.8v to around 1.20v minimum. This vCore is also reflected in what is coming from the VRM
No matter what I do I cannot get the system to park cores again, or the vCore to drop to it's previous low sub-1v idle level.

I have to action a reboot and then things seem to be stable.

So this generally happens at some random time on the first boot after a cold start. A reboot seems to fix the behaviour and it doesn't happen again until the next time it's booted from cold (the next day).

Temperatures don't look to be drastically rising, but maybe they are a couple of degrees higher than they would be. With an NH-U14s things stay pretty cool anyway.

I've added ParkControl to my system tray to alert me when Core Parking seems to stop.

Any clue what is going on?
X370 TaiChi | 1700X P3.10 stock clocks | (2x 16GB) 32GB FlareX 2400MHz.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VUMeter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Aug 2019 at 12:21am
I can add more info here.
I came home in the afternoon, booted cold and the system would not park.

Looking at HWiNFO:

Core #X VID (where X is 0-7 for the 8 cores) is at 0.400v to 1.500v. They are lively and jumping around a lot, despite an idle desktop even after waiting for stuff to settle.

vCore SV12 TFN is around 1.28v but spends a fair time at 1.35v and does go to around 1.45v. Rarely drops below the 1.28, and when it does it's only down to 1.18v anyway.

VR OUT from the IR35204 chip is very similar to SV12 TFN vCore.

vCore (from the motherboard) drops to 0.400v for very brief periods but mainly sits 0.9v or above. We all know this is not vCore, but something like the requested voltage from the motherboard or some jazz, I forget. It's not a number to care about unless it's 1.5v or something crazy.

I tried a sleep cycle, just setting Windows to sleep, then bringing it back up. No change. Let Windows settle after waking, and it's still stuck in higher voltage, responsive no-parking mode.

Reboot....

After a reboot and letting Windows settle.

Core # VID: Mostly at 0.400v but occasionally jumping up to 1.500v or 1.475v on any particular core at max. Mostly activity is seen on any particular core going to 0.894v or 0.900v.
Behaviour seems odd if most cores are parked, why is voltage fluctuation over 8 cores? I think OS tools are BS-ing me!

vCore SV12 TFN sits mostly at 0.794v-0.800v but jumps up to 1.281v and 1.400v max.
VR Out follow similar trend.


Under both conditions temperature jumps momentarily to around 36簞C but rapidly falls back to 28簞C as the baseline temperature.
Noctua NH-U14s cooler is set to have the fan running at 30% as minimum speed, so plenty of cooling power is available, and easily keeps tiny spikes cool.

At a loss as to why this happens.
I guess, in a perfect world, I'd love to see software tell me exactly what is going on where and how, but it seems a lot of the info on how the chip operates is not really public domain.

I have previously experimented witch disabling 4 cores completely and running a 4c/8t CPU, but it saved no watts at the wall, none that I could measure enough to say there was a difference. So I am happy to park the cores that I don't need when browsing, idle on desktop, checking emails etc. but still have the rest kick in when doing something more strenuous like A/V transcoding.
X370 TaiChi | 1700X P3.10 stock clocks | (2x 16GB) 32GB FlareX 2400MHz.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cx5 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Aug 2019 at 12:00pm
@VUMeter I'm curious to ask how much can your ram overclock?

You have such a great system, I hope you will endeaver the ram overclock and for sure to use 1.35V DDR4 and 1.1V SOC as a start.

and would recommend you upgrade bios via each necessary milestone to reach v5.6, was very good for my ram, not sure about yours, hopefully give you an edge.

Or you have tried v5.6 but finds v3.1 still the best ???

Last night I flash v5.67 (the last of the mohicans = last beta unofficial pcie-4 for x370 taichi) and ram cannot run 2933mhz using previously successful timing. Tonight will try to find new timing. New calculator timing also not working, sad sad.
3800x Taichi_X370 CX750M Sapphire 5700 pulse PoseidonAbsoluteZero3 Barrow PWM-17w>CPU>420x140x28 TT_core_V71
ram = 4x8gb HOF4CXLBS3600K17LD162C
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VUMeter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Aug 2019 at 4:38pm
@cx5

Hi thanks for your suggestions, but I have no desire to overclock my system at present. I intend for this system to last about 10 years, as that is my usual upgrade cycle.

Chasing fps for games is not something I care about, and have actively limited the GPU to 60fps (monitor cannot display any faster) and around 75% power.

Stability and longevity is what I wish. Everything is plenty fast enough.


As for the BIOS version. I stopped at P3.10.
It offered the fan control I needed over previous versions and saw no reason to update, in fact I saw reasons not to go with higher versions.


An update to the original post.
I did have the 100MHz clock set to Auto in BIOS. I set it to manual and 100MHz, and so far I haven't seen the cores unpark. This is a first cold boot this morning. More time will tell, as it seems to randomly occur but only on the first cold boot.
X370 TaiChi | 1700X P3.10 stock clocks | (2x 16GB) 32GB FlareX 2400MHz.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cx5 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Aug 2019 at 6:00pm
Originally posted by VUMeter VUMeter wrote:

@cx5
Hi thanks for your suggestions, but I have no desire to overclock my system at present. I intend for this system to last about 10 years, as that is my usual upgrade cycle.


@VUMeter, Hey, it's the same for me. 10 years life from a PC. Now, if only I can resists to play with it too much.

Actually I also don't OC CPU and RAM, exactly as you say, having enough.

Just trying to match the bought spec, i.e. 3000mhz ram in my case, should run 3000 or 2933....

But no harming playing once in a while. 10 years is a long time......
3800x Taichi_X370 CX750M Sapphire 5700 pulse PoseidonAbsoluteZero3 Barrow PWM-17w>CPU>420x140x28 TT_core_V71
ram = 4x8gb HOF4CXLBS3600K17LD162C
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cx5 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Aug 2019 at 10:00am
Originally posted by cx5 cx5 wrote:

Last night I flash v5.67 (the last of the mohicans = last beta unofficial pcie-4 for x370 taichi) and ram cannot run 2933mhz using previously successful timing. Tonight will try to find new timing. New calculator timing also not working, sad sad.


Clarification, in case this info could help someone.

Two nights ago I used the wrong timings hence 2933 couldn't work. Last night realized my mistake, hence quickly revert to timings in my signature and uefi 5.67 works immediately.

HOORAY, pcie-4 beta v5.67 uefi = the last of the mohicans, now lets wait for this price to come down [URL=https://www.tomshardware.com/news/phison-pcie-4.0-ssd-ps5018-e18-e13t-e16,40131.html]7GB/s pcie-4 PHISON E18 coming soon[/URL]

@VUMeter, My ram default 1.2v jedec runs 2133, as well as 2400 and 2666. The timings are default within the jedec library/rom thing.

they even up the vddcr_soc by themselves, for 2666mhz soc is 0.875v

Runs like a charm. Always works regardless of uefi version.

In the past didn't manage to make it work because I choose XMP first (which has incompatible timing with cpu) then change speed to 2666, that's why always fail.

But if I don't choose xmp at all, just choose 2666mhz directly, it will always boot successfully.

Overclock without voltage up, good prospect to you???
3800x Taichi_X370 CX750M Sapphire 5700 pulse PoseidonAbsoluteZero3 Barrow PWM-17w>CPU>420x140x28 TT_core_V71
ram = 4x8gb HOF4CXLBS3600K17LD162C
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VUMeter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Aug 2019 at 4:47am
@cx5 Please don't take this the wrong way. But at this point I have no real interest in making anything run beyond spec.d parameters. It's probably easy and a 'free' overclock, but it's not something I am too fussed about at all for the time being.

Back to my original post:
Nope, setting the BCLK to a locked 100MHz does nothing to affect a change in this behaviour. It seems to stop it wandering so much when watching HWiNFO (is it correctly reported? Why would the BCLK not stick rigidly to 100MHz?), but doesn't cure my issue.
I have updated the chipset drivers, again no change.

Short of a CMOS reset, I am not sure why this is happening?

ZoneAlarm firewall/anti-virus is a known entity which does cause some strange behaviour. Could it be this that might be the culprit?
I wouldn't bother so much with a 3rd part firewall, except that the alerts are rather informative with ZA and non-existent with Windows own protections. I prefer to be alerted about every small thing happening rather than an overall program accessing the internet. ZA informs me of registry access as well, which is handy to stop startup programs being added.

But why would a Windows restart cure the issue so swiftly, and for it not to happen again after the first reboot?

I am very tempted to boot into Linux Mint Cinnamon 19.x from USB stick to see what happens on the next cold boot. A cleaner system which is up to date should give me some better indications of what is happening.
Sure, no Windows Core Parking, bit I might be able to read voltages with the applicable tools accessed.
X370 TaiChi | 1700X P3.10 stock clocks | (2x 16GB) 32GB FlareX 2400MHz.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VUMeter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Aug 2019 at 6:03am
I installed ProcessLasso and aggressively shoved all programs onto the first core and it's two threads 0 and 1.
Whilst there was very little activity jumping beyond those two threads, the others would not park.

Checking out Power Profiles, it is almost as if "Ryzen Balanced" is permanently engaged on cold boot. The current seems higher and vCore doesn't drop much.
If I reboot and use Ryzen Balanced profile, the behaviour is fairly similar to that of a cold boot with ANY profile.

The fact that voltage and current seem to be higher, this can't be a good thing? The on die temperature seems about the same though, so perhaps the numbers are a bit of BS. Voltage + Current = Power. Power = Heat. But there isn't any real heat, not enough for me to really declare it obvious - maybe the cooler is just too efficient for that.

Rebooting on cold start really cannot be good for this machine!

Linux requires installing so that I can add ntc6775 to the /etc/modules file. This needs to be done and the system rebooted. Cannot be done with a 'live' Linux USB stick as it wont stay on reboot.
X370 TaiChi | 1700X P3.10 stock clocks | (2x 16GB) 32GB FlareX 2400MHz.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VUMeter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Aug 2019 at 8:38pm
I've disabled the Rightmark PPMP Service which is a service installed when the Rightmark Power Profile editor tool is used. I am not sure of it's impact on the system and why it needs to be running as a service - I don't think I am using any features of that side of things, except for deep editing and creating a power saving version of Ryzen Balanced Power Profile.

We'll see how this plays out - couldn't test that long today as a BSOD caused a reboot dxgmms2 - something to do with DX graphics? - whatever.

As far as testing in Linux is concerned, everything looks normal but I don't have enough insight into sensors to tell for sure.
We get the Nuvoton sensor reporting, which is what we see in BIOS and most GUI tools in Windows. That wasn't hard to get working.
However, SV12 TFN on the CPU and the VRM OUT from the IR35204 chip are not reported in anything except for HWiNFO in Windows.
Watching the C-state in Linux, most time is spent in C2, which is what I would expect, idle frequency is reported ~2GHz as expected.

I'll continue to test in Linux and in Windows (with PPMP disabled).
X370 TaiChi | 1700X P3.10 stock clocks | (2x 16GB) 32GB FlareX 2400MHz.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VUMeter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Aug 2019 at 5:25am
So much for that.
What it looks like is the CPU being stuck in P0 state.
All cores were at 3500MHz and a 35x multiplier, not coming down!
Voltage around the 1.2v which is what we get when all cores are hit with Prime95.
Voltage jumps for the odd single core boosting to 3900MHz.

At this point, I think I need a CMOS reset and set up things neatly again. I think something has gotten borked somewhere.

I am half tempted to try the ZenStates program, but as it's an unoffical tool and has been fiddled with so it works on other platforms than Asus motherboards, I fear damage.

CMOS reset and I'll report back.
X370 TaiChi | 1700X P3.10 stock clocks | (2x 16GB) 32GB FlareX 2400MHz.
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