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X370 Taichi VCore nasty spikes

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zlobster View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zlobster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: X370 Taichi VCore nasty spikes
    Posted: 02 Sep 2017 at 9:17pm
Hey there, fellas!

I'm also a long-time PC enthusiast, and I have built and tweaked many PCs during the years. I'm a happy owner of a X370 Taichi for some time now. That's where the bad part starts. Read below.

I bought a brand new X370 Taichi from a renowned German web shop 2 months ago. It came with BIOS version 2.40 pre-installed. Immediately I plopped a brand new 1700X in it, booted and changed the BIOS version to 3.0, which was the latest at that time.

With everything left at auto, I installed Win 10 Pro on a 960 EVO. After running Ryzen Master and HWiNFO64 I noticed some odd CPU VCore behavior. When CPU was under light or no load I could see some nasty voltage spikes, even though no OC was in place and all was left on auto. When CPU is under heavy load, VCore settles between a good 1.20V and 1.25V with NO voltage spikes.

Check it all on the screenshots below.

System overview:


HWiNFO64 readings from MULTIPLE sensors:


Idle mode behavior. Note the bad spikes:


CPU is loaded here. Note how spikes disappear when the load kicks in:



All this is still present no matter which LLC option I choose, no matter XMP or mem defaults. This is even present with the latest BIOS version 3.10! Bear in mind that I have done many CMOS resets, incl. every time I was updating the BIOS. I HIGHLY doubt these are just bad readings.

I also have no issues with thermals or performance; I just think these spikes are a killer in the long run.

ASRock staff, forum fellas, help!

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wardog View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote wardog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Sep 2017 at 11:09pm
HWiNFO shows a running time of 1min 12sec. Is that from 1m12s immediately after booting into the OS, or just a randon 1m12s of.... whenever?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote parsec Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Sep 2017 at 11:21pm
Do NOT use Auto VCore voltage! You are lucky you only get spikes to ~1.48V. If you check the VIDs in HWiNFO at the top of the sensor display, if your board is like mine (X370 Killer SLI/ac), they are over 1.5V. If you over clocked your CPU with Auto VCore, it would be even higher.

In the OC Tweaker screen, set CPU Frequency and Voltage Change to Manual.

You can leave the CPU Frequency on the value shown, which should be the stock base clock speed, 3400.

The CPU Voltage shown should be 1.35V, or you can change it to 1.35V or whatever you like.

Next, scroll down to the Voltage Configuration area, and set CPU Vcore Voltage to Offset Mode. That's what I use, if you want to use Fixed, that's your choice. I use Offset Mode, with the Offset Voltage set by pressing the '+' key once, to change it from Auto to 0.00625V.

Your board's UEFI may be a bit different than mine, but those are the main things to do. I set CPU LLC to Level 2.

You can experiment with various VCore voltages using Offset or Fixed, but you really must set CPU Frequency and Voltage Change to Manual, or you'll get the usual high Auto VCore voltages that are programmed into the UEFI/BIOS. That is done to insure all processors will work for users that don't do anything in the UEFI/BIOS. I'm surprised you've never seen the Auto VCore setting on other boards give very high VCore voltages, I've never had a board that didn't do that.

The spikes you see are just higher CPU load situations, with the cores at Turbo speed. I just read about a new Gigabyte UEFI/BIOS release for their Ryzen boards that has the VCore up to 1.7V!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zlobster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Sep 2017 at 11:33pm
Originally posted by wardog wardog wrote:

HWiNFO shows a running time of 1min 12sec. Is that from 1m12s immediately after booting into the OS, or just a randon 1m12s of.... whenever?


Let me assure you, this is just one snap of the phenomenon. That bug is always present, being it in a freshly booted system, or one that ran for 48 hours.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zlobster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Sep 2017 at 11:39pm
Thanks, parsec!

Quite useful info, indeed. I have to admit same thing has crossed my mind on many occasions. Due to my mediocre experience with Ryzen platform I'm not sure how a fixed voltage would affect the system.

On my previous AMD builds I always ended up with a fixed multiplier, manual voltages and CPB disabled. As I mentioned, I'm not yet experienced with Ryzen, so I decided I'll give it a try on auto. Boy, was I wrong! Big smile

So, I want to keep CPB/XFR on, and I want to use Qool'n'Cuiet (R) (TM). Can I just put some sane offset voltage and call it a day?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zlobster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Sep 2017 at 11:46pm
Originally posted by parsec parsec wrote:


 I'm surprised you've never seen the Auto VCore setting on other boards give very high VCore voltages, I've never had a board that didn't do that.

The spikes you see are just higher CPU load situations, with the cores at Turbo speed. I just read about a new Gigabyte UEFI/BIOS release for their Ryzen boards that has the VCore up to 1.7V!



I've been using only ASUS until now. I haven't used an ASRock since many moons. ASUSes always gave me very little to no spikes at all when running auto.

I also read about some fried Ryzens with latest Gigabyte blobware. Multi billion companies can't even properly test a build. Clap

Offtopic - if these auto voltage values were put there deliberately, then what is the life expectancy of the CPU in the board? Is this a way to enforce the planned obsolesce?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote datonyb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Sep 2017 at 4:03am
ive had set 3.9 ghz and 1.3 volts fixed voltage and llc 2

heres the taichi guide

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52Tw-wcT7o4

my p states settings are

9c
8
27

that will make sense when you watch the video
[url=https://valid.x86.fr/jpg250][/url]

3800X, powercolor reddevil vega64, gskill tridentz3866, taichix370, evga750watt gold
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote nangu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Sep 2017 at 5:13am
On my X370 K4 auto voltages spikes go up to 1.55v. Insane!!

I saw this behaviour only on this Asrock board. On my previous AMD builds I used Gigabyte and Asus, but may be this is a general Ryzen thing so may be all boards for this generation AMD cpus suffer from the same.

Another weird thing I can see on these Ryzens are temp spikes under load. You run, in example, the AIDA64 stress test, and after a while the cpu temp settles at 57簞, and from time to time HWINFO64 registers temp spikes up to 65簞 in a very short timeframe. 

If you want to set manual voltages and also get the power savings, use the pstate overclock method with offset voltages, adjust LLC (I suggest LLC 3 as max. If you need more LLC it's because you set a weak vcore from the start) and the Ryzen balanced power plan on Windows.

Cheers. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zlobster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Sep 2017 at 5:43am
I was just researching what datonyb said. These custom P-states are very powerful thing! It's as close to metal as you can get. With these you can program the CPU on a low HW level, pretty much as you wish. 2000MHz for idle? You gots it! 4000MHz for the lulz? You gots it! Thanks, AMD.

I don't think I've noticed the temp spikes you're mentioning. Then again, I don't use AIDA64 for reading or stress-tesitng. HWiNFO64 reports good and stable temps for me. My advice to you is to check if your CPU cooler is seated properly and the TIM is spread well. Improper cooler contact with the CPU IHS is a frequent reason for the thing you're mentioning.

I will definitely try tweaking the UEFI these days and I'll report back the results.

On a side note, I'd really like to hear ASRock's engineering justification behind these crazy auto VCore voltages, and see a fix in the future.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote nangu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Sep 2017 at 5:59am
Thanks for the suggestion, I had these spikes with the 1700 stock cooler, and now with my new CLC. Temps are very good across the board, but I suspect these very very short timed spikes are related to voltage spikes which monitoring software can't register due the speed at these voltage changes occur, and may be are LLC related when full load decrease a bit.

Anyway, it's not related to your question so I'm sorry to hijack your post.

Cheers.
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