ASRock Forums : M2 SSD Compatability

M2 SSD Compatability : Hi parsec,Thanks for clearing...

Sat, 27 Aug 2016 06:07:45 +0000

Author: xPorta
Subject: 2603
Posted: 27 Aug 2016 at 6:07am

Hi parsec,

Thanks for clearing up my misconception about the lane allocations. ++

Re: MBR

I manually specified MBR using GParted to sidestep any UEFI and GTP friction with the OS installer. The UEFI is set in compatibility mode, so it was smooth.

Re: 750 Ti

I also have a bootable OCZ Vertex 4 on the system.. in running OS in that device with the vids stored on the NVMe 950 Pro... there was no stuttering.

In that config the vids and 750 are served up on PCIe..

So some of the workload went onto the Vertex 4 SATA bus for some reason...
Video driver and GPU+CPU may have transactions with temp files outside memory while doing these tasks.

Re: NVMe driver

It's been a native Linux kernel driver since kernel version 3.3 (18 March 2012)
I'm running 4.4 version right now. You can imagine my impatience waiting for mobo houses to bring it to the BIOS/UEFI but that's an 'ecosystem' thing, do you think?.
Anyway, that stuff I said about fluffware and NVMe vs SATA.. that was BS in retrospect, that's my fault, it's actually a few of the higher level GUI apps that are lagging a little with ability to display storage device Mfgr/Model etc.

Using the lsblk command ( List block devices), the correct info was displayed in the terminal for the NVMe based 950 Pro
aside: lsblk command at the bottom of the page...
http://fibrevillage.com/storage/53-lsblk-command-examples

M2 SSD Compatability : xPorta wrote:HI Crazynex, parsec,...

Thu, 25 Aug 2016 23:00:13 +0000

Author: parsec
Subject: 2603
Posted: 25 Aug 2016 at 11:00pm

xPorta wrote:

HI Crazynex, parsec, Xalter and Phillium.
So, I appreciate the stuff I read on this thread.. good advice and info.
I got the Samsung 950 Pro running with only one or two hiccups that were dealt with.

Rig:

ASRock Fatal1ty 990FX Killer, BIOS P1.60 01/06/2016
AMD FX(tm)-8150 Eight-Core Processor (family: 0x15, model: 0x1, stepping: 0x2)
ASUS Hyper M.2 X4 (PCIe to M.2 adapter card)
Samsung 950 Pro
Operating System: Ubuntu 16.04.1 LTS

First, installing Ubuntu 16.04 to the 950 Pro in the mobo M.2 connector went with one hiccup. NO MBR on the device.. but no messages to indicate that. So, briefly, I did the install there (X2), but later got the ASUS PCIe to M.2 adapter card and redid the whole install there.

So following the advice I found on the web:

Before the install of the OS, first create an MBR and a partition on the device.. and a file system (I chose ext4) , possibly use GParted Live, or GParted in another linux computer..
Install the OS, cautious people unplug other SATA devices, I hear.
choose the option 'Install to Other' which allows you to look at the devices on your system and pick the right one.
Select the partition and mark it as the root of the file system.
When installing, install to the device, not the partition.. something to do with where the GRUB2 bootloader ends up maybe. So select the device.. like mine was device nvme0n1 and the partition was nvme0n1p1.
Then follow the menus.

So, benchmarks show that I'm using PCIe version 2 in the results... but I still like them and I can move the 950 Pro to my new machine when I upgrade.. like ASRock ZEN FX mobos this Christmas?. I'm dreaming..

so Benchmarks.. as they are, are here: http://imgur.com/a/NjGKb

PCIe 3.0 would be faster.

So I'm also running an Nvidia GX 750 Ti mid level graphics card. I noticed that if I run 4 HD 1080p movies at once in different VLC windows, , when I load a 4K movie on top of that, it gets choppy. Hard times! So that's when the SSD competes with the graphics card for bandwidth on the PCIe 2.0 bus, doing these tasks.

Comments on the state of Ubuntu w.r.t. the device: it works.. but I notice that that benchmark pic doesn't show the device manufacturer nor the model. So, NVME works.. but some of the fluff software that exists for SATA isn't aware or can't use the NVME interface to get that info... today.. August 25, 2016. : )

I'm sure the 950 does not compete for bandwidth with the video card. The PCIe lane allocation depends on which PCIe slots are being used, since an x16 physical slot does not necessarily mean that it will be connected to 16 PCIe lanes.

The 990FX chipset provides 38 PCIe 2.0 lanes, so on your board you do have two true PCIe 2.0 x16 slots, each with x16 PCIe 2.0 lanes. The PCIE3 slot is x16 physically, but x4 electrically, since it is only connected to 4 PCIe lanes. That is stated in the specs, and you can see the difference between the PCIE3 slot and the other two if you look carefully at the top down picture of your board.

IMO, your 750 is simply choking on the load of that many 4K videos. You are lucky it does as well as it does now. You aren't using all of your PCIe 2.0 lanes now, and each device has its maximum lane connection now, you can't change that.

Were you able to install the Samsung NMVe driver in Ubuntu? If not, Ubuntu must have its own NVMe driver.

Strange that your 950 as the OS drive is MBR partitioned. In Windows, NVMe SSDs are GPT partitioned. No idea what's going on there.

NVMe and SATA are two different interfaces, using different drivers and controllers. If the software used with SATA drives works with NVMe, that's just luck.

M2 SSD Compatability : HI Crazynex, parsec, Xalter and...

Thu, 25 Aug 2016 13:48:19 +0000

Author: xPorta
Subject: 2603
Posted: 25 Aug 2016 at 1:48pm

HI Crazynex, parsec, Xalter and Phillium.
So, I appreciate the stuff I read on this thread.. good advice and info.
I got the Samsung 950 Pro running with only one or two hiccups that were dealt with.

Rig:

ASRock Fatal1ty 990FX Killer, BIOS P1.60 01/06/2016
AMD FX(tm)-8150 Eight-Core Processor (family: 0x15, model: 0x1, stepping: 0x2)
ASUS Hyper M.2 X4 (PCIe to M.2 adapter card)
Samsung 950 Pro
Operating System: Ubuntu 16.04.1 LTS

Before the install of the OS, first create an MBR and a partition on the device.. and a file system (I chose ext4) , possibly use GParted Live, or GParted in another linux computer..
Install the OS, cautious people unplug other SATA devices, I hear.
choose the option 'Install to Other' which allows you to look at the devices on your system and pick the right one.
Select the partition and mark it as the root of the file system.
When installing, install to the device, not the partition.. something to do with where the GRUB2 bootloader ends up maybe. So select the device.. like mine was device nvme0n1 and the partition was nvme0n1p1.
Then follow the menus.

so Benchmarks.. as they are, are here: http://imgur.com/a/NjGKb

PCIe 3.0 would be faster.

M2 SSD Compatability : I forgot to say, if you bought...

Wed, 25 May 2016 11:47:24 +0000

Author: parsec
Subject: 2603
Posted: 25 May 2016 at 11:47am

I forgot to say, if you bought an M.2 to PCIe slot adapter card like this one:

http://www.amazon.com/Lycom-DT-120-PCIe-Adapter-Support/dp/B00MYCQP38

You could put it in the PCIE5 slot, and get PCIe 2.0 x4. That would put your video card down to x8, of course.

Not sure if you could boot an OS from a PCIe slot with your board, but I don't know that it won't work either.

Hopefully someone who has tried that and sees this will let us know.

M2 SSD Compatability : I agree, and you're not the...

Wed, 25 May 2016 11:22:46 +0000

Author: parsec
Subject: 2603
Posted: 25 May 2016 at 11:22am

I agree, and you're not the only one that was confused or possibly provided misinformation about the SM951.

It was never meant to be sold at retail. You can't find it listed among Samsung's SSD product information, whether AHCI or NVMe. It's not really supported by the Samsung Magician software.

But, the AHCI SM951 can be used in boards that don't have NVMe support. It also is a very fast SSD, still among the fastest SSDs available.

NVMe support is very new to AMD boards, and is new on Intel boards too. I would like to see for myself how good the NVMe support really is on AMD boards.

I have a Fatal1ty 970 Performance/3.1 board that has a UEFI update for NVMe support, so I'll give it a try. Not full support for PCIe 3.0 x4 NVMe SSDs, but they should work.

This is what a 256GB AHCI SM951 does with a full PCIe 3.0 x4 interface. I would hardly call this bad compared to the NVMe SM951 or 950 Pro:

A 256GB 950 Pro on the same mother board:

This simple benchmark does not tell the entire story about either SSD's performance, but they aren't that much different in the basic performance aspects. Both of our AMD boards can't match the bandwidth on this (latest generation) Intel board, but it will be faster than any SATA SSD on our boards. I've had no problems with my AHCI SM951, I think its great.

M2 SSD Compatability : Thanks for the reply, you were...

Wed, 25 May 2016 09:21:54 +0000

Author: Phillium
Subject: 2603
Posted: 25 May 2016 at 9:21am

Thanks for the reply, you were right on all accounts. A bit disappointing as I had rather hoped it was NVMe, but its still plenty fast for my purposes.

M2 SSD Compatability : Phillium wrote:I'm having...

Tue, 24 May 2016 09:09:01 +0000

Author: parsec
Subject: 2603
Posted: 24 May 2016 at 9:09am

Phillium wrote:

I'm having a similar issue with my SM951 (UEFI version 1.6) where I cant get the motherboard to set it up as NVME, it only registers AHCI and i cant even find where in the UEFI I might change that, as the system overview has little information and zero functionlity, and theres no M.2 labled functions.

I'm assuming the same mother board as the OP, the Fatal1ty 990FX Killer?

FYI, the first and much more common version (of an overall rare SSD) of the SM951 SSD is an AHCI type of PCIe SSD. I own two of them.

You own an AHCI SM951 too, given what you have described.

The model number of the AHCI version of the SM951 is MZHPV256HDGL, for the 256GB version.

The model number of the NVMe version of the SM951 is MZVPV256HDGL.

The model number is on the sticker of your drive, or can be read by various software. It should show up in Device Manager like this:

You can also see how an NVMe SSD is listed in Device Manager, and the entries for their controllers, both AHCI and NVMe. The correct driver for each type of SSD is loaded automatically.

The NVMe version of the SM951 was available for a short while before the first Samsung M.2 NVMe SSD meant to be sold at the retail level was released, the Samsung 950 Pro.

While the SM951 SSDs in AHCI and NVMe models use identical SSD controllers, the firmware each one has is different, and is what makes the SSDs either AHCI or NVMe.

There is nothing in any mother board's UEFI that can change an SM951 from AHCI to NVMe. That is solely based on the drive's firmware.

How can you change the firmware? You can't. Samsung would need to provide that, and they don't. The SM951 is not supported by the Samsung Magician software, which is where firmware updates can be done with supported Samsung SSDs.

We are very lucky that ANY AMD chipset board, particularly the old 990/SB950 pair used in your board, can support any PCIe M.2 SSD, AHCI or NVMe.

The latest Intel boards that support PCIe M.2 NMVe SSDs do not have any additional functionality either. That Intel chipset is far beyond the AMD 990/SB950, and actually provides the full bandwidth required by an SM951 or 950 Pro (PCIe 3.0 x4).

We are lucky that we can use SSDs on the same physical interface (M.2), while they use different protocols. If you expect them to be the same as SATA drives in the UEFI, then you will be disappointed.

M2 SSD Compatability : I'm having a similar issue...

Tue, 24 May 2016 05:03:28 +0000

Author: Phillium
Subject: 2603
Posted: 24 May 2016 at 5:03am

I'm having a similar issue with my SM951 (UEFI version 1.6) where I cant get the motherboard to set it up as NVME, it only registers AHCI and i cant even find where in the UEFI I might change that, as the system overview has little information and zero functionlity, and theres no M.2 labled functions.

M2 SSD Compatability : 2 PCIe 2.0 lanes is roughly a...

Sat, 07 May 2016 14:16:01 +0000

Author: Xaltar
Subject: 2603
Posted: 07 May 2016 at 2:16pm

2 PCIe 2.0 lanes is roughly a quarter of the bandwidth of 4 PCIe 3.0 lanes. Basically PCIe 3.0 x1 = PCIe 2.0 x2. Now the question is, does the M.2 SSD saturate the full PCIe 3.0 x4 bandwidth, if so then it's peek performance will be bottlenecked by 75% on a PCIe 2.0 x2 interface.

As Parsec suggested, save yourself a little money and pick up a regular SATA SSD, you will likely not notice a difference in your system between SATA and M.2.

M2 SSD Compatability : Crazynex wrote:If I update...

Sat, 07 May 2016 13:17:21 +0000

Author: parsec
Subject: 2603
Posted: 07 May 2016 at 1:17pm

Crazynex wrote:

If I update the bios will it then work to its full potential. Im asking as the speeds between pcie and sata are so massively different. so if it isnt going to make a difference I will just got with the sata m2

No, the BIOS update to version 1.60 is just for compatibility with the new and different NVMe protocol.

No BIOS update can make changes to hardware such as the type of interface (PCIe 2.0 or PCIe 3.0) and the number of physical data lanes used by a hardware interface (such as two (x2) or four (x4) PCIe lanes) like M.2.

Your board and AM3+ processors do not provide any PCIe 3.0 interface. The M.2 slot is physically wired as x2, two PCIe 2.0 data lanes.

The SM951 requires a PCIe 3.0 x4 interface for full performance. Your board's M.2 slot is only x2, so that will reduce the data rate by 1/2 alone. Then the lower data transfer rate of PCIe 2.0 instead of PCIe 3.0 will reduce performance even further, sorry to say.

Then there is the reality of real world performance, what we as a user experience or feel while using the PC with a SATA SSD or an NVMe PCIE SSD.

While you may consider the difference in speeds between PCIe and SATA SSDs as "massively different", the actual difference in real world use between the two types of SSDs is very small to none at all most of the time. I say this after having used both types on multiple PCs, SATA SSDs for years, PCIe SSDs for at least six months. This is with boards that provide a full PCIe 3.0 x4 interface to the PCIe SSDs.

So my suggestion to you is if you don't plan on getting a new mother board and CPU for a year or more, just get an M.2 SATA SSD. If you do plan to update your board and CPU within a year, get the Samsung SM951 now, and use it on the new board later.

If you've never used an SSD before, just get a SATA SSD, the difference between that and any HDD is massively different. The difference between a SATA SSD and PCIe SSD is not massively different.