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x570 Taichi - all the issues I've had thus far

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Topic: x570 Taichi - all the issues I've had thus far
Posted By: Cecil_Montgomery
Subject: x570 Taichi - all the issues I've had thus far
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2019 at 5:29pm
Just to be clear, this is not an angry rant post, but rather an explanation of the issues I've experienced trying to get this system up and running, in the hopes that someone out there in ASRock land either has a solution, or realises these are issues and takes steps to resolve them going forward.

By way of background, I'll spec out my system:

Mainboard: x570 Taichi
CPU: 3900x
RAM: 16gb(2x8) Corsair Dominator 3600C18 (CMT16GX4M2C3600C18)
Storage: Corsair Force Series MP510 1920GB M.2 NVME SSD
Case: Lian Li PC 0-11 Dynamic
GPU: EVGA GTX1080 SC
Cooler: Corsair H1150iPro 360mm AIO
Case cooling: 3x Corsair ML120 fans
PSU: Corsair HX750i

I'd like to note that the ram is listed as compatible with the motherboard on ASRock's website. That being said, here are the issues:

USB-C Header: This USB type C header is directly in line with the top PCIE slot on the mainboard. Even though my case has a connector with a right-angle plug on it, it still sticks up too far once plugged in to allow the GPU to connect into the PCIE slot. Instead, the rear of the GPU touches down on the connector before the card is close enough to plug in. I expect this will be an issue on most large GPUs, and I expect most people buying a motherboard this high up the product stack are putting such a GPU in their system. I have temporarily resolved the issue with a vertical GPU riser, but that won't work once I upgrade to a PCIE gen 4 GPU. Does the 2nd slot support full kx16 if the first is unoccupied? If so, that might be a solution.

Fan Noise: defaulting the bios to have max RPM at all times is not a good look for your mainboard (I know tom's hardware were savage in their review because of the noise). As soon as I powered it up, my heart sank and I thought "what have I done!" Once I found the "quiet" setting in Bios, that made it a bit better, but once the chipset gets past 60-65C, the fan is again the loudest part of my PC, even on the "quiet" profile.

Ram compatibility: As mentioned above, I have 3600mhz ram, albeit with fairly loose timings. I bought this because AMD specify that this is the sweet spot for Infinity Fabric clock speeds. enabling XMP profiles on the out-of-the-box bios worked a treat, but updating the BIOS meant that as soon as I re-engaged XMP the machine failed to get past the post screen. I slowly back-stepped through the BIOS revisions, determining that 1.21 is the most recent BIOS that allows my PC to boot with XMP enabled.

CPU clock speeds: Obviously now all my attempts to extract performance from my CPU have to be done on BIOS 1.21. In this bios revision, I cannot find any way to get the CPU to naturally boost past 3.9ghz even on single core workloads, even turning PBO up as high as I could. I then went in and manually overclocked, being stable at 4.1ghz all core and 1.3v with almost no effort. Unfortunately, switching it back to Auto leaves it booting in 4.1 manual clock, and the only way to get the system to think it's in normal boost mode is to clear the CMOS.

So here I am. Running my GPU on a header because it won't plug in the slot it's meant to without hitting another connector, and running a 4.1ghz all core "overclock" because I can't upgrade my bios version any higher without tanking my ram speed...


Anyone have any thoughts? Suggestions? Obvious things I've overlooked?



Replies:
Posted By: Jakob84
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2019 at 7:00pm
yea seems the usb c header is not really in a optimal spot on that board.... i have the x470 taichi. On that board its placed slightly higher so there is clearence for gpus... i never use the header though.

What do you use the usb c for?

Dont use PBO. Its still very iffy on most boards. Needs some work from amd i think. I cant even boot with pbo atm but my 3700x clocks easy 4200 1.35v manual overclock.

How are you thermals? if the cpu is too hot it wont boost very high...


Posted By: Cecil_Montgomery
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2019 at 7:13pm
I have a type C phone I connect. It doesn't have to connect to that spot, I just feel like there has to be a better long term solution than "never use that header because ASRock stuffed up", but it is my Plan B.

Thermals are decent. even running multiple all core cinebench runs back to back (like 12) I can't get the Ryzen Master temp reading to ever hit 80 (and that's at 1.3v). Idle is about 41, and single core workloads it doesn't really break 50. AIO water temp is about 30 (ambient of 25). Running everything on auto, I've had it actually sit at 3750 (good effort for a 3800 base clock) on all core workloads with the temps in the 60's. Long story short, unless I clock it to 4.2 all core and 1.325v (which is slightly unstable, haven't looked into why yet), the temps never leave the green zone in Ryzen Master.

I'm thinking of just leaving it on 4.1 all core manual clock, and waiting a few weeks for some BIOS maturity at this piont. Would be good to know if PCIE slot 2 runs 16 lanes to the CPU if slot 1 is unoccupied though. Putting the GPU down there would solve quire a few problems at once...


Posted By: Jakob84
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2019 at 8:12pm
pretty sure you can only get display on pcie 0.


Posted By: brucer
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2019 at 9:16pm
These ryzen 3000's are also limited by temperature.. Are you sure you're not being limited by cooling issues?

-------------
Asrock x570 Taichi, Ryzen3800x, 32gb Gskill Royal 36000mhz@ 3733mhz, Samsung 250gb 970evo plus for OS drive, Sabrent Rocket 1tb nvme storage drive.


Posted By: Cecil_Montgomery
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2019 at 8:42am
Originally posted by brucer brucer wrote:

These ryzen 3000's are also limited by temperature.. Are you sure you're not being limited by cooling issues?


Based on a few comments on here I've gone back and done a LOT more testing. I've tried the latest bios (with default ram speeds, because XMP won't work with 1.60), v 1.21 with XMP, default out of the box settings, PBO maxxed out, etc. etc.

Leaving the CPU to do it's own thing, the best I got was a single core boost to 4.2ghz, and the Ryzen Master temp was in the 50's. The all core on that setup ran 1.4v and 3.9ghz, so it hit 80c in one run and was still slow...

The best all-core I've gotten was 4.0ghz which it ran at 1.35v, peaking at 80c (not suprising given the voltage).

My manual OC I've settled on is a 4.15ghz at 1.3125v. This is stable single core load at 52c. All cores loaded up i couldn't get Ryzen Master to read over 78c even after 10 back-to-back cinebench R20 runs.

I think the out-of box performance on all cores is actually pretty right on the later versions of the bios (comparing to Gamers Nexus temp/boost testing), its just unfortunate it default pumps more volts into it than it needs to be stable.

It's the single core not boosting that's the issue (combind with the XMP and the usb-c port issues, obviously). Withe everything sitting at just over HALF max allowable levels, it just refuses to turn up the wick even close to what it says it will do on the box...


Posted By: mrgadget
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2019 at 4:42am
Just regarding the fan, I had similar experience and first POST gave me buyer's remorse for a while.

After playing with the settings and trying out different stuff, the easiest solution is to install ASRock Atuning.

With this you can easily configure fan curves, you can test fan speeds etc. What I have noticed is that temps for chipset are around 59 - 62 celcius, regardless if fan spins 2500, 3000 or 6000 rpm.

So I have set SB_Fan so that until 63C it is 25% and 65C 30%, these are basically silent and temps won't exceed at least for me higher.

If you have much higher temps you need to plan airflow better.

On a final note, X570 is either on or off, so it doesn't undervolt on light use. So the temps what you'll see idling in BIOS are your regular temps. Try to be around 60 celcius mark.



Posted By: mrgadget
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2019 at 4:46am
Also try setting everything on Auto in your BIOS and instead tweak Windows power profiles, AMD Robert has more info on. his Reddit post. sorry I am on mobile, would have linked otherwise.

Just saying minimize manual stuff as you'll interfere with what AMD has planned and most likely you won't gain huge performance boost.


Posted By: mrgadget
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2019 at 4:57am
Originally posted by Jakob84 Jakob84 wrote:

pretty sure you can only get display on pcie 0.

Tech City (YouTube) did analysis on VRM overheating and as a one solution he moved GPU to lower slot.

OP, manual says every PCI-E slot is x16 so try moving to middle slot, this fixes your usb-c header problem.

U recommend this, interesting video and MB is x570 taichi, he also has reviewed on another video:

https://youtu.be/D5l1MUMHXt0


Posted By: mrgadget
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2019 at 5:02am
Sorry for spamming but remember rear has 1x usb-c and you can buy 4pack (0,5m, 1m, 2m, 3m) usb-c cables from Amazon like 8 euro/USD :)


Posted By: shmerl
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2019 at 5:27am
Do you know if LEDs are on by default, and is there any way to disable them from the firmware? I'm planning to get X570 Taihci, but I'm going to be using it on Linux, so I need to be sure that LEDs can be turned off without requiring to use Windows only tools.


Posted By: mrgadget
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2019 at 1:35pm
Originally posted by shmerl shmerl wrote:

Do you know if LEDs are on by default, and is there any way to disable them from the firmware? I'm planning to get X570 Taihci, but I'm going to be using it on Linux, so I need to be sure that LEDs can be turned off without requiring to use Windows only tools.
RGBs are on by default, under 'Tool' menu you have an option called 'RGB LED' and you can configure effect or toggle it completely 'Off'.

Here is how menu looks, direct link:

https://www.techpowerup.com/review/asrock-x570-taichi/images/bios_61-copy.jpg , if that doesn't work, here is link to the article page from which screenshot is taken: https://www.techpowerup.com/review/asrock-x570-taichi/5.html

There was also a setting for "Turn On LED in S5" so you can disable that as well, it is on by default.



Posted By: Cecil_Montgomery
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2019 at 3:53pm
Originally posted by mrgadget mrgadget wrote:

Just regarding the fan, I had similar experience and first POST gave me buyer's remorse for a while.

After playing with the settings and trying out different stuff, the easiest solution is to install ASRock Atuning.

With this you can easily configure fan curves, you can test fan speeds etc. What I have noticed is that temps for chipset are around 59 - 62 celcius, regardless if fan spins 2500, 3000 or 6000 rpm.

So I have set SB_Fan so that until 63C it is 25% and 65C 30%, these are basically silent and temps won't exceed at least for me higher.

If you have much higher temps you need to plan airflow better.

On a final note, X570 is either on or off, so it doesn't undervolt on light use. So the temps what you'll see idling in BIOS are your regular temps. Try to be around 60 celcius mark.



I set the Chipset fan to "Quiet" in the Bios. This has it sitting at about 2500rpm at about 57c (+/- 2c). You are right in that it's not too bad at this volume, and as soon as I put some load into the system or some noise in the room, it is inaudible. Unfortunately, with 6 ML120 maglev Corsair fans in the case running at 1000rpm when not under load, it's still the loudest thing in the room when the PC's at Idle. In the grand scheme of things, if this was the only issue with my board, I'd be fine with it.

Originally posted by mrgadget mrgadget wrote:


Tech City (YouTube) did analysis on VRM overheating and as a one solution he moved GPU to lower slot.

OP, manual says every PCI-E slot is x16 so try moving to middle slot, this fixes your usb-c header problem.

U recommend this, interesting video and MB is x570 taichi, he also has reviewed on another video:

https://youtu.be/D5l1MUMHXt0


The manual states the following:

3 x PCI Express 4.0 x16 Slots (PCIE1/PCIE3/PCIE5: single
at x16 (PCIE1); dual at x8 (PCIE1) / x8 (PCIE3); triple at x8
(PCIE1) / x8 (PCIE3) / x4 (PCIE5))

This implies that only the top slot is wired for 16, as it specifies that when only one slot is in use, the slot that runs at 16x is slot 1. Middle slot is likely only wired for x8. Given that I've run this GPU on a PCIE gen2 mainboard with no loss in GPU intensive benchmarks, I'd say it could run in a x16 slot that's only wired for x8 just fine. But my next GPU may not be so kind. Yes, the easy solution is to unplug the header and that's likely what i'll do in the long run, but it's kind of like buying a car where the electric windows won't operate if you have something plugged into the lighter socket. It's not a deal breaker, but for those people who want to use both those features at once, it'll get SUPER annoying, SUPER quickly... and smacks of poorly thought out design, because it's not something you should have to implement a workaround for...


Originally posted by shmerl shmerl wrote:


Do you know if LEDs are on by default, and is there any way to disable them from the firmware? I'm planning to get X570 Taihci, but I'm going to be using it on Linux, so I need to be sure that LEDs can be turned off without requiring to use Windows only tools.



lights can be controlled in the BIOS and in windows software. can be set to all off. board actually still looks very good with the lights off, I have mine set to a static white, which is actually more of a blue-white. It looks good and is inoffensive.


In light of the ongoing BIOS issues related to AMD, I'm probably going to stick to the plan from my last post, and await a level of BIOS maturity i (somewhat naively, perhaps) would have expected this line of boards to have hit the market with. In that time i'll wait and see what else happens in the world of enthusiast computing!


Posted By: mrgadget
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2019 at 5:21pm
Originally posted by Cecil_Montgomery Cecil_Montgomery wrote:



I set the Chipset fan to "Quiet" in the Bios. This has it sitting at about 2500rpm at about 57c (+/- 2c). You are right in that it's not too bad at this volume, and as soon as I put some load into the system or some noise in the room, it is inaudible. Unfortunately, with 6 ML120 maglev Corsair fans in the case running at 1000rpm when not under load, it's still the loudest thing in the room when the PC's at Idle. In the grand scheme of things, if this was the only issue with my board, I'd be fine with it.


Yeah try playing around with different RPM settings and maybe you'll find a good balance :) Maybe it can manage ~60C with ~2000rpm.

Originally posted by Cecil_Montgomery Cecil_Montgomery wrote:


The manual states the following:

3 x PCI Express 4.0 x16 Slots (PCIE1/PCIE3/PCIE5: single
at x16 (PCIE1); dual at x8 (PCIE1) / x8 (PCIE3); triple at x8
(PCIE1) / x8 (PCIE3) / x4 (PCIE5))

This implies that only the top slot is wired for 16, as it specifies that when only one slot is in use, the slot that runs at 16x is slot 1.


It does say three times PCI-E 4.0 x16 slots and lists the available slots. I agree the latter part is a bit confusing, but I think it tells user that when you want two GPUs, use slots 1 and 3, not 3 and 5.

I think you need to test, mode can be easily seen/confirmed if that is x16 or x8.

Originally posted by Cecil_Montgomery Cecil_Montgomery wrote:


Yes, the easy solution is to unplug the header and that's likely what i'll do in the long run, but it's kind of like buying a car where the electric windows won't operate if you have something plugged into the lighter socket. It's not a deal breaker, but for those people who want to use both those features at once, it'll get SUPER annoying, SUPER quickly... and smacks of poorly thought out design, because it's not something you should have to implement a workaround for...

I agree and I could easily be in the same position as you are now, I also like high-end graphics card and I was almost buying a new chassis with usb-c but in the end decided to use my old.


Originally posted by Cecil_Montgomery Cecil_Montgomery wrote:


In light of the ongoing BIOS issues related to AMD, I'm probably going to stick to the plan from my last post, and await a level of BIOS maturity i (somewhat naively, perhaps) would have expected this line of boards to have hit the market with. In that time i'll wait and see what else happens in the world of enthusiast computing!


Yes though after closely following x350/b450/other older boards, I would say x570 users are in good position, and yes we should be as we purchased the latest and greatest, but there are dozens of users who can't even get their system to POST with 3000 series CPU on it.


Posted By: Cecil_Montgomery
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2019 at 6:50pm
Originally posted by mrgadget mrgadget wrote:


Originally posted by Cecil_Montgomery Cecil_Montgomery wrote:


The manual states the following:

3 x PCI Express 4.0 x16 Slots (PCIE1/PCIE3/PCIE5: single
at x16 (PCIE1); dual at x8 (PCIE1) / x8 (PCIE3); triple at x8
(PCIE1) / x8 (PCIE3) / x4 (PCIE5))

This implies that only the top slot is wired for 16, as it specifies that when only one slot is in use, the slot that runs at 16x is slot 1.


It does say three times PCI-E 4.0 x16 slots and lists the available slots. I agree the latter part is a bit confusing, but I think it tells user that when you want two GPUs, use slots 1 and 3, not 3 and 5.

I think you need to test, mode can be easily seen/confirmed if that is x16 or x8.


You're right. I did need to test. So I pulled out the you riser, and shone a flashlight into the slot. Can confirm PCIE3 is a x16 physical slot, only wired up to the x8 connector. There the silver contacts stop, and it's black plastic from there back. So a hard no on any slot other than the top being x16.


As for the rest of it, I'll keep tweaking and tinkering, and learning from others' experiences with this board, chip, and chipset.

It'll be interesting to see it unfold.


Posted By: Disturbed
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2019 at 8:17pm
So only the top is x16 but the manual says all 3 are? Wtf is that about. My card won't fit in top either because of the same reason.


Posted By: Xaltar
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2019 at 10:25pm
PCIe 3.0 x8 is still more than enough for modern GPUs, you shouldn't have any issues running at x8, I have not seen any performance drops using any of the GPUs I have tested in x8 slots. Dropping to an x4 slot may cost you 5-10fps on a high end GPU in some games but even there, generally your performance will remain unchanged. Moreover, if you game at higher resolutions than 1080p the GPU will become a bottleneck LONG before you eat up your PCIe bandwidth, even on an x4 slot. This becomes an even more moot point if you are able to utilize PCIe 4.0 which effectively doubles PCIe 3.0 bandwidth. At present I believe only AMD's new 5700 series GPUs support PCIe 4.0 however.

This is a little understood area for a lot of people, I hope this helps to clarify.

-------------


Posted By: mrgadget
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2019 at 11:09pm
Originally posted by Xaltar Xaltar wrote:

PCIe 3.0 x8 is still more than enough for modern GPUs, you shouldn't have any issues running at x8, I have not seen any performance drops using any of the GPUs I have tested in x8 slots. Dropping to an x4 slot may cost you 5-10fps on a high end GPU in some games but even there, generally your performance will remain unchanged. Moreover, if you game at higher resolutions than 1080p the GPU will become a bottleneck LONG before you eat up your PCIe bandwidth, even on an x4 slot. This becomes an even more moot point if you are able to utilize PCIe 4.0 which effectively doubles PCIe 3.0 bandwidth. At present I believe only AMD's new 5700 series GPUs support PCIe 4.0 however.

This is a little understood area for a lot of people, I hope this helps to clarify.
Yeah Gamers Nexus did a test and dual (SLI) Titan V's were just approaching x8 capacity.


Posted By: shmerl
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2019 at 7:15am
Originally posted by mrgadget mrgadget wrote:

RGBs are on by default, under 'Tool' menu you have an option called 'RGB LED' and you can configure effect or toggle it completely 'Off'.


Good to know thanks!


Posted By: shmerl
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2019 at 7:16am
So what's the current situation with chipset fan noise with X570 Taichi? Is quite profile helping with it?


Posted By: Disturbed
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2019 at 7:55am
I set fan to manual as a part oboe started (25/30% @ 60c) and that helps a ton.


Posted By: foxx1337
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2019 at 4:02pm
Hey Cecil - what are the power and current readouts on your 3900X + Taichi X590? Mine are very wrong, half of what they should be. If I turn off a CCD they get halved once again so I'm in a bit of a pickle here whether to do anything about anything.

PPT - 70 watts
TDC - 43 amps

as seen in Ryzen Master during a Prime95 small FFT test
https://imgur.com/a/Z01Nu4H

or in HWiNFO64 at the same time
https://imgur.com/a/nDkakhs

What values do you see?

-------------
Ryzen 3900X, Taichi X570


Posted By: mrgadget
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2019 at 7:37pm
Originally posted by shmerl shmerl wrote:

So what's the current situation with chipset fan noise with X570 Taichi? Is quite profile helping with it?

Quiet profile works but I have configured it manually. I'd say 3500 rpm or lower it is quite silent, or my other fans make more noise. I don't have an issue with the fan but I could imagine if someone has started building and #1 priority has been noise levels then you might be in trouble. I have front fans (140mm), top fan (200mm) and side fan (140mm).

That 3500 rpm equals about 45% power and chipset temp is around ~59-63C.



Posted By: TheBigNoob
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2019 at 9:39pm
I've had a mostly okay experience with the X570 Taichi, until yesterday morning when I got back into the office. Sounds like my chipset fan is grinding already, anyone have any ideas? I've attempted to contact ASRock, but still no response yet.

Here's a video of the fan starting up.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/9oHaDFcNBZRseVqo8

Hopefully they can send me out a replacement cooler.

Also, does anyone seem to have a pair of calipers to determine the distance between the board and the and the rear backplate? I'm trying to figure out if there's a way I can put a heatpad there to help conduct heat away from the chipset and onto the metal that's behind the board.


Posted By: shmerl
Date Posted: 24 Jul 2019 at 4:48am
Originally posted by TheBigNoob TheBigNoob wrote:

I've had a mostly okay experience with the X570 Taichi, until yesterday morning when I got back into the office. Sounds like my chipset fan is grinding already, anyone have any ideas? I've attempted to contact ASRock, but still no response yet.

Here's a video of the fan starting up.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/9oHaDFcNBZRseVqo8



That is horrible. Sounds like the fan is defective. I wonder if anyone will figure out custom cooling solutions for such chipsets? They can really benefit from bigger and more silent fans.



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