Intel Motherboards - B85M-ITX - NIC + CPU C6 = SLOW INTERNET

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B85M-ITX - NIC + CPU C6 = SLOW INTERNET

Printed From: ASRock.com
Category: Technical Support
Forum Name: Intel Motherboards
Forum Description: Question about ASRock Intel Motherboards
URL: https://forum.asrock.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=2365
Printed Date: 10 Jan 2025 at 9:45am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.04 - http://www.webwizforums.com

Topic: B85M-ITX - NIC + CPU C6 = SLOW INTERNET

Posted By: cimba007
Subject: B85M-ITX - NIC + CPU C6 = SLOW INTERNET
Date Posted: 03 Apr 2016 at 3:39am

Hello,

i recently purchased an B85M-ITX on ebay for cheap and got myself a G1840 Celeron in addition.

Both are working quite well .. but I still have some huge issues as soon as I enable energy saving features.

What I did so far:

- Update do BIOS 2.50

- Enable all C-State realated settings

- Enabled C6 Package C-State

So far so good .. my rig is runnig quite and smooth .. PC to PC network performance is remarkagble .. 110MB/s .. close to the theoretical gigabit cap ..

But then ...

Downloading stuff from the interweb is terrible slow

- I got a 35MBit connection (verified by other PCs in my household)

- .. changed network cables, switch, direct connection to the fritzbox ..

- Windows 10 32bit .. the same as Windows 8.1 64bit ..

- All NIC-driver versions I could find from 2.1.0.7 to 2.1.0.21

What did I obverseve:

- Default BIOS/UEFI .. no issues

- Enabling C-States .. slow Internet download .. fast Network transfer ..

- Switching from gigabit auto negotiation to 100Mbit full duplex .. no issues, Internet ~35mbit .. as it should be.

With slow internet download I mean ~3Mbit .. jumping eradically .. nothing solid ..

Switching from 2.50 to 2.40 got me 3-18Mbit .. but all far from stable ..

My guess is the C6 State and the integrated NIC are interfering terrible ..

I will try out to selectivly disable Package and CPU C-States to find the culprit .. still .. this is not acceptible ..

Replies:

Posted By: Xaltar
Date Posted: 03 Apr 2016 at 3:47am

Did you install Xfast LAN? If so uninstall it and try the internet connection again.

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Posted By: cimba007
Date Posted: 03 Apr 2016 at 3:59am

HI Xaltar, i did not install this tool .. only RST driver (required for C6 to work) and other drivers like VGA ..

I might add .. I tried Bios 2.20, 2.30, 2.40 and 2.50 with 2.40 being the "least" worst so far.

Slow with C-States enabled

http://postimg.org/image/biu567u7h/" rel="nofollow">

Slow with C-States enabled (Package C-State fully disabled)

http://postimg.org/image/5khiwazd1/" rel="nofollow">

Fast without C-Stats (aka all set to Auto, Package C-State disabled as on default)

http://postimg.org/image/q2cl1zt41/" rel="nofollow">

Same testfile from my local ISPs testpage .. the issue affects other sites/speedtests as well

Remember .. this only affects Internet-Downloads .. Windows Shares or HTTP Download from a local Computer in my LAN has no issues at all

Just another fun fact .. if i enabled C-States .. download something (slow) and THEN start a File Transfer from my local network (higher cpu utilization) the internet download speeds up to full speed.

So my educated guess is .. low-cpu utilization + high c-state usage = slow network

Posted By: Xaltar
Date Posted: 03 Apr 2016 at 4:21am

That is very interesting, thanks for sharing the info. So basically when the CPU is throttled back due to low usage the download speeds are slow. It sounds like C-states are effecting the LAN bandwidth, when the CPU picks up beyond a certain frequency the bottleneck is gone and things function as they should....

I would suggest you create a support ticket and ask Tech Support directly about your issue, it would help if you include a link to this thread so they can see what you are dealing with exactly.

As you have noticed changes between different BIOS versions I would guess that it has something to do with the way the BIOS is handling C-States which you will need tech support's assistance with.

Good luck and let us know how it goes.

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Posted By: parsec
Date Posted: 03 Apr 2016 at 11:00am

cimba007 wrote:

Hello,

i recently purchased an B85M-ITX on ebay for cheap and got myself a G1840 Celeron in addition.

Both are working quite well .. but I still have some huge issues as soon as I enable energy saving features.

What I did so far:

- Update do BIOS 2.50

- Enable all C-State realated settings

- Enabled C6 Package C-State

So far so good .. my rig is runnig quite and smooth .. PC to PC network performance is remarkagble .. 110MB/s .. close to the theoretical gigabit cap ..

But then ...

Downloading stuff from the interweb is terrible slow

- I got a 35MBit connection (verified by other PCs in my household)

- .. changed network cables, switch, direct connection to the fritzbox ..

- Windows 10 32bit .. the same as Windows 8.1 64bit ..

- All NIC-driver versions I could find from 2.1.0.7 to 2.1.0.21

What did I obverseve:

- Default BIOS/UEFI .. no issues

- Enabling C-States .. slow Internet download .. fast Network transfer ..

- Switching from gigabit auto negotiation to 100Mbit full duplex .. no issues, Internet ~35mbit .. as it should be.

With slow internet download I mean ~3Mbit .. jumping eradically .. nothing solid ..

Switching from 2.50 to 2.40 got me 3-18Mbit .. but all far from stable ..

My guess is the C6 State and the integrated NIC are interfering terrible ..

I will try out to selectivly disable Package and CPU C-States to find the culprit .. still .. this is not acceptible ..

When you say that the reduced Internet download speeds when using the CPU C State power saving options is not acceptable, what do you expect to be done about it?

Do you think this is some kind of mistake or bug in the mother board or the BIOS?

Intel has designed and implemented the CPU power saving options, like C States, and built them into their processors. A mother board manufacture can only allow us to enable or disable these power saving options. They cannot change the way they work, or when they are active. We can change when they are enabled or not in the BIOS, and can change to a degree when they become active with the Windows Power Plan settings for the CPU Minimum processor state.

The C6 C State stops one or more processor cores from doing any work at all. They are almost completely turned off. They will be turned on in a very tiny fraction of a second if there is enough load or work for the CPU to do, but that depends upon the internal algorithm programmed into the CPU by Intel.

The Intel networking chips in my ASRock boards have options called "Offloads", that when enabled allow the networking chip to do certain tasks that are otherwise done by the OS/Windows, which of course uses the CPU and software to do that work. A typical task that can be Offloaded to the network chip is segmenting TCP messages into valid Ethernet frames. Another is checksum calculations. The network hardware is much better and more efficient at performing these tasks, but the Offloads are not Enabled by default by the Intel networking driver software.

Your board's Atheros chip may have similar options, you should check if they are enabled.

But that alone may not fix the download speed to satisfy you. All you can do is disable the C States in the BIOS, or find a way to deactivate them when a download is happening. I'm surprised a G1840 will stay in the C6 state on one of its cores for very long. My i7 processors are over 90% in the C6 state when the PC is idle.

I tested my download speeds using Task Manager with C States enabled and disabled. Testing download speeds is not always easy, as the source of the download is a limiting factor of any download, and can vary widely over time.

I personally found no difference in download speeds with C States enabled or disabled. But, being in the USA, which is NOT known for its high speed Internet connections, I am no where near 34Mbit/s. I have a good ISP for the USA, but my sustained speeds are 1/4th that of what you get in Germany. Yes I have IPV6.

Your slowest speed is faster than my fastest burst speed. Everything is relative, and IMO you have nothing to complain about. How can you call your speeds "terrible slow", all my internet pages are displayed instantly.

What are you blaming for your "terrible slow" download speeds?

-------------
http://valid.x86.fr/48rujh" rel="nofollow">

Posted By: cimba007
Date Posted: 03 Apr 2016 at 10:32pm

Responses within the quote in italic

parsec wrote:

When you say that the reduced Internet download speeds when using the CPU C State power saving options is not acceptable, what do you expect to be done about it?

I am not technican .. but what I expect is that network traffic arriving at the NIC wakes up the CPU so that it can do it work.

Do you think this is some kind of mistake or bug in the mother board or the BIOS?

I am not sure what it is .. but I "suspect" a too agressive usage of power saving features.

Intel has designed and implemented the CPU power saving options, like C States, and built them into their processors. A mother board manufacture can only allow us to enable or disable these power saving options. They cannot change the way they work, or when they are active. We can change when they are enabled or not in the BIOS, and can change to a degree when they become active with the Windows Power Plan settings for the CPU Minimum processor state.

Again .. I am not totally sure if the Power-States only control the CPU .. the descriptions sounds like Power-States are much more dependent on the other hardware like PCI-E bus, HDD, USB-Devices etc.

The C6 C State stops one or more processor cores from doing any work at all. They are almost completely turned off. They will be turned on in a very tiny fraction of a second if there is enough load or work for the CPU to do, but that depends upon the internal algorithm programmed into the CPU by Intel.

This is what I expect the CPU to do .. no work = low power .. but if there is work (like internet download) then .. no time for too much sleeping

The Intel networking chips in my ASRock boards have options called "Offloads", that when enabled allow the networking chip to do certain tasks that are otherwise done by the OS/Windows, which of course uses the CPU and software to do that work. A typical task that can be Offloaded to the network chip is segmenting TCP messages into valid Ethernet frames. Another is checksum calculations. The network hardware is much better and more efficient at performing these tasks, but the Offloads are not Enabled by default by the Intel networking driver software.

Your board's Atheros chip may have similar options, you should check if they are enabled.

All offload features are enabled. (Remark: Forcing 100Mbit FD resolves the problem too .. no idea why)

But that alone may not fix the download speed to satisfy you. All you can do is disable the C States in the BIOS, or find a way to deactivate them when a download is happening. I'm surprised a G1840 will stay in the C6 state on one of its cores for very long. My i7 processors are over 90% in the C6 state when the PC is idle.

Using ThrottleStop to deactivate Package-States does not impact the issues. 90%? wow .. your lucky ;-) my Mouse+Keyboard+USB-Soundcard drag me from 80% to 40% C6 .. but this is not that big of an issue.

I tested my download speeds using Task Manager with C States enabled and disabled. Testing download speeds is not always easy, as the source of the download is a limiting factor of any download, and can vary widely over time.

I totally aggree .. the testfile I am using is hosted at my local ISP .. I tried some other speedtest-sites too .. all with the same result .. only local network transfer (either HTTP or FileShares are totally fine)

I personally found no difference in download speeds with C States enabled or disabled. But, being in the USA, which is NOT known for its high speed Internet connections, I am no where near 34Mbit/s. I have a good ISP for the USA, but my sustained speeds are 1/4th that of what you get in Germany. Yes I have IPV6.

So your sustained speed is like ~8.5Mbit .. and you would not be mad if you would only get 3mbit ouf of it?

Your slowest speed is faster than my fastest burst speed. Everything is relative, and IMO you have nothing to complain about. How can you call your speeds "terrible slow", all my internet pages are displayed instantly.

This if of cause all pure subjective feelings .. but getting 3mbit out of 34mbit with PC A and getting 34/34 with PC B (same switch, same room) feels wrong.

What are you blaming for your "terrible slow" download speeds?

I don't blame anyone to have made my speed slow on purpose .. I just wan't to hint, that here might be a bug hidden somewhere which "might" be resolved with a future BIOS-Update (in fact 2.50 BIOS update reads like "2.Update Network module." .. so maybe they tried to improve the matter and I just got unlucky with my special use case and did not get the benefigt.

Terrible slow (for me) just means getting worse experience from PC A then PC B (my other PC is an Asrock Z77-Pro4 with an i5-3570k) .. where I don't get any negative influence with all Energy-Saving features enabled.

Still .. thank you for your long response and that you took your time to read it all .. I just trie to solve my issue the best and most constructive way.

Posted By: cimba007
Date Posted: 03 Apr 2016 at 10:49pm

100Mbit (fast)

http://postimg.org/image/ohc0i4iej/" rel="nofollow">

1Gbit (slow)

http://postimg.org/image/amupwqfpl/" rel="nofollow">

This just let me think the issues is caused by a wrong interaction with power-down states and the nic ..

100Mbit solves the issue

Packet Limit Cstate to C3 solves the issue ..

Edit:

Checking "netstat -e" (might be related, might not be)

With Package Limited To C6 (slow) (gbit)

Verworfen (dropped) 1640 0

Fehler (error) 1640 0

With Package Limited To C3 (fast) (gbit)

Verworfen 0 0

Fehler 0 0

So I even get like 100-200 packet errors per second too .. (only tesed for like ~8seconds)

Posted By: cimba007
Date Posted: 04 Apr 2016 at 2:59am

please close

Posted By: softskiller
Date Posted: 15 Apr 2016 at 3:20am

Why close?
Did you fix your problem?

Disable C-States or disable auto negotiation of network speed?

I also have a B85M board.

Do you also notice USB mouse lag?

Do you also see lots of shared ressources I/O Ports, IRQs and Memory Address also for the atheros NIC in the systeminfo?
Do you also see more than 500 assigned IRQs for ACPI Compliant System?

The default windows 10 network driver is older than the one asrock offers for Win8!
They do not offer one for Win 10.

I also posted here about the weird C-State behaviour of the board B85M board series:
http://forum.asrock.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=2057&KW=&title=asrock-b85mhds-b85m-pro4-c6-c7-support

Posted By: badincite
Date Posted: 10 Jul 2016 at 8:21pm

I'm having the same issue and adjusting the C-states is making no difference. Another thing that's odd is there's no option to manually set your speed to gigabit under speed and duplex. Has any figured out a fix for this? I wasn't having this issue with windows 8 and the G3258 processor I had. I just recently installed a 4790k and windows 10 when I noticed the speed issue.

Posted By: badincite
Date Posted: 11 Jul 2016 at 12:02am

Never mind located a faultily switch line