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X370 Killer SLI huge volt. drop, impossible to OC

Printed From: ASRock.com
Category: Technical Support
Forum Name: AMD Motherboards
Forum Description: Question about ASRock AMD motherboards
URL: https://forum.asrock.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7097
Printed Date: 17 Apr 2024 at 7:02am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.04 - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: X370 Killer SLI huge volt. drop, impossible to OC
Posted By: adsaidler
Subject: X370 Killer SLI huge volt. drop, impossible to OC
Date Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 9:20am
Guys, I really need some help here.

I'm trying to overclock a 1800x to 4Ghz, and it's proving to be a nightmare on this board.

When I set the voltage to 1.45v on Ryzen Master and start stress testing with AIDA64, the voltage drops to an average of 1.378v, and the system crashes after a couple of minutes. Monitoring is done using HWINFO64.

I tried setting the voltage to 1.4625v and later 1.46875v; this allowed the average voltage under load to stay around 1.4v, keeping the system stable for around 15min, when i stopped stress testing.

The issue is that when idling, it idles to this extremely high voltage.

There is no Load Line Calibration option in the BIOS; it was discussed in a topic here that it was removed from newer versions of the  X370 Killer SLI.

I tried OCing from the BIOS, with no success; setting the voltage to 1.45v and the clock to 3900 or 4000mhz doesn't post.

I'm running out of options here, and really regretted getting this board. Any advice would be really appreciated!





Replies:
Posted By: PetrolHead
Date Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 3:01pm
" rel="nofollow - First things first, I hope you know that 1.35V is the highest Vcore that AMD consideres safe for 24/7 use. Go higher than that and you'll risk damaging your CPU in the long term. Another thing you should keep in mind is that not all Ryzen CPUs can do 4GHz and stay stable. Depending on whether you lose or win in the silicon lottery, your CPU may be able to achieve anything between 3.8GHz and 4.1GHz before hitting the Vcore wall. Having the 1800X does not guarantee better overclocking results than with, say, a 1700.

Personally I'd forget Ryzen Master and overclock from the BIOS in small steps. If you want to squeeze everything your system has to give, just start by setting Vcore to 1.35V and clock speed to 3.7GHz. Then keep increasing the clock speed until your system is not stable. When you find the point of instability, you're close to your maximum safe overclock. If HWMonitor and the like are showing Vcore below 1.35V you may still have some headroom for bumping the voltage, but Ryzen chips tend to hit a Vcore wall around the safe voltage, so to get a 100MHz increase in clockspeed you may need to increase the Vcore so that you'll end up in danger zone.

By the way, what PSU and cooling solution are you using? And what temperatures has the CPU been hitting when you've been testing with AIDA64?


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Ryzen 5 1500X, ASRock AB350M Pro4, 2x8 GB G.Skill Trident Z 3466CL16, Sapphire Pulse RX Vega56 8G HBM2, Corsair RM550x, Samsung 960 EVO SSD (NVMe) 250GB, Samsung 850 EVO SSD 500 GB, Windows 10 64-bit


Posted By: adsaidler
Date Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 7:08pm
Thanks for the reply, PetrolHead!

I'm aware of the safe voltage for 24/7 usage, but an AMD representative disclosed a couple of months ago that 1.45v was the maximum voltage that should be used for more extreme overclocks.

This is not the issue thou. The issue is the voltage dropping absurdly when stress testing with AIDA.

As I said previously,  the voltage drops to an average of 1.378v as shown in HWINFO64, when it is set to 1.45v on Ryzen Master. 1.378 under load can keep 3.9Ghz stable.

BIOS OC is problematic for some reason, since it doesn't boot at 3800, 3900 or 4000 Mhz @ 1.45v, so I'm using Ryzen Master. Tried BIOS versions 2.5 and 3.4.


I'm using a Cooler Master V1000 80 Plus Gold power supply, a Cooler Master MasterLiquid 240 cooler, and temps fluctuate around 74c. 

RAM is Samsung b-die 3200mhz CL15. XMP profile is set to 3200mhz, no other settings are changed.






Cooler Master ATX V1000


Posted By: zlobster
Date Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 7:20pm
" rel="nofollow - Are you using the latest UEFI?

You may want to tweak the LLC as well.


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1700X ZP-B1 (stock); X370 Taichi (UEFI 3.10); 16GB F4-3200C14-8GFX XMP; 256GB 960 EVO; RX 580 NITRO+ 8GB


Posted By: adsaidler
Date Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 7:27pm
Originally posted by zlobster zlobster wrote:

" rel="nofollow - Are you using the latest UEFI?

You may want to tweak the LLC as well.

zlobster, I'm using the latest UEFI. This motherboard's newer revison like the one I have does not have LLC options in the UEFI, unlike the first ones had.


Posted By: adsaidler
Date Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 7:29pm
Right now, I'm stress testing for 30 minutes the following: 3900Mhz, 1.45v @ Ryzen Master. HWINFOI informs an average CPU Core Voltage of 1.37v. If the stress test stops, it jumps right up to 1.45v at idle.


Posted By: PetrolHead
Date Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 8:12pm
Hmm. Your PSU should be a quality unit and unless you're running a multi-GPU setup it's totally overkill, so that should not cause any issues. With the VRM your motherboard has it doesn't feel like VRM temperatures should be a big issue even though the liquid cooler takes away the airflow it would receive with the stock cooler... It's also weird that BIOS overclocking would be so problematic and it sure sound like LLC is precisely the thing you would want here, assuming the CPU can do 4GHz stable in the first place. Maybe it could be worth it to contact ASRock's support directly, describe the issue and ask if they could include LLC in future BIOS updates. Just for the heck of it you could also try setting up a fan so that it cools the VRM, just to see if the extra cooling has a noticeable impact on the voltage droop.


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Ryzen 5 1500X, ASRock AB350M Pro4, 2x8 GB G.Skill Trident Z 3466CL16, Sapphire Pulse RX Vega56 8G HBM2, Corsair RM550x, Samsung 960 EVO SSD (NVMe) 250GB, Samsung 850 EVO SSD 500 GB, Windows 10 64-bit


Posted By: adsaidler
Date Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 8:19pm
" rel="nofollow -
Originally posted by PetrolHead PetrolHead wrote:

Hmm. Your PSU should be a quality unit and unless you're running a multi-GPU setup it's totally overkill, so that should not cause any issues. With the VRM your motherboard has it doesn't feel like VRM temperatures should be a big issue even though the liquid cooler takes away the airflow it would receive with the stock cooler... It's also weird that BIOS overclocking would be so problematic and it sure sound like LLC is precisely the thing you would want here, assuming the CPU can do 4GHz stable in the first place. Maybe it could be worth it to contact ASRock's support directly, describe the issue and ask if they could include LLC in future BIOS updates. Just for the heck of it you could also try setting up a fan so that it cools the VRM, just to see if the extra cooling has a noticeable impact on the voltage droop.

Petrol, the PSU comes from my previous build, and is barely 1 year old, and I'm running a single 1070 now.

VRM average temps for the last hour is 84c.

I'm pretty sure it can do 4Ghz stable, since it's over an hour stress testing @ 3.9 1.38v, no problem.

I sent AsRock an email describing the issue. Do you know of any other means to get in touch with AsRock regarding this issue?

Does any AsRock technical personnel frequent this forum?

Thank you!!


Posted By: PetrolHead
Date Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 8:30pm
Okay, so VRM temperatures should be okay as well. I have no personal experience pushing Ryzen's to their limit, but from what I've read and heard it may be that to get 4GHz you need a big jump to the Vcore compared to 3.9GHz. That's the Vcore wall I referred to previously; it can be easy to get to a certain point and a real pain trying to push the CPU any further. In any case having access to LLC settings would probably help.

Unfortunately I don't know of any other means to get in touch with ASRock. They do sometimes respond to threads in the forum, but if it's something that can be solved through forum advice, I think you'll have more luck getting help from the forum moderators (Parsec, wardog and Xaltar, I think). They give great advice, but can't of course help if the BIOS is missing some features you would need.


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Ryzen 5 1500X, ASRock AB350M Pro4, 2x8 GB G.Skill Trident Z 3466CL16, Sapphire Pulse RX Vega56 8G HBM2, Corsair RM550x, Samsung 960 EVO SSD (NVMe) 250GB, Samsung 850 EVO SSD 500 GB, Windows 10 64-bit


Posted By: adsaidler
Date Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 8:43pm
Petrol,

Exactly, if I had LLC options to keep the voltage under load as close as possible to the defined voltage, things would go way more smoothly.

I sent the guys a private message, and am hoping they take a look at this topic!


Posted By: datonyb
Date Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 11:08pm
" rel="nofollow - the trouble is ..............

despite many claims of 4ghz stable overclocks, there are only a few

hitting 4ghz and booting windows and completing cinebench isnt a stable overclock
sitting at 4ghz for 24hrs of prime would be considered stable

not a lot of ryzens would be able to do this even on flagship boards

dont believe me ? go read the crosshair6 overclocking thread on overclockers..............

hitting 3.9 stable increases the odds by an extreme amount, also note the very high amount of people reporting such a massive increase in volts to get that extra 100mhz

personally i think in agreement that the lack of llc may be a big factor in your case,but if you havnt got the option, then you dont have that option


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[url=https://valid.x86.fr/jpg250][/url]

3800X, powercolor reddevil vega64, gskill tridentz3866, taichix370, evga750watt gold


Posted By: zlobster
Date Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 11:23pm
4GHz is definitely possible. One should be extremely intimate with all the sub-timings and voltages, though. Just because many have luck and hit 4GHz with a simple voltage bump doesn't guarantee everyone will.

Another option is BCLK OC, which is a thing on its own.

Also, few stable benchmarks and stress test mean zilch. When I was beginning to step into the world of OC, I was often eluded that my OC are stable. Often the OC crumbles badly over only a specific workload. To claim some OC to be perfectly stable one needs to put the PC under vigorous testing for at least a few months. All the rest are fairy tales.


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1700X ZP-B1 (stock); X370 Taichi (UEFI 3.10); 16GB F4-3200C14-8GFX XMP; 256GB 960 EVO; RX 580 NITRO+ 8GB


Posted By: chainsaw
Date Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 11:45pm
if you can exchange the MOBO for a launch Rev. you can get LLC. Sad that ASRock is removing features on new revisions. When we look up reviews about the mobo they are often from early in the release cycle. when asrock removes features as time goes on it really does a dis-service to the end users.

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ASRock Fatal1ty X370 Gaming K4 P3.40
AMD RYZEN 7 1700 @ 4Ghz 1.39v
Noctua NH-D15 "blocks top 1x pci-e"
16GB GSkill Ripjaw V F4-3200C16D-16GVRB @ 2933 14-15-15-15 T1 1.365v
GTX 1080 x2 Sli


Posted By: adsaidler
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 12:22am
Originally posted by chainsaw chainsaw wrote:

if you can exchange the MOBO for a launch Rev. you can get LLC. Sad that ASRock is removing features on new revisions. When we look up reviews about the mobo they are often from early in the release cycle. when asrock removes features as time goes on it really does a dis-service to the end users.

That is the problem. I feel extremely mislead.


Posted By: adsaidler
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 12:30am
Just running a successful 5-hour AIDA64 run. 3.9Ghz, 1.40v on Ryzen Master, with 1.32v under load, below 70c. Will try a 12hour Prime95 and 12h AIDA64 to assess stability.

The 0.07v drop is killing the overclockability past this point.

I'll wait for AsRock's support to respond; maybe enabling LLC on this version could be possible in newer BIOS versions. I remember someone saying it was not necessary due to VRMs being replaced, but no one said it was impossible.


Posted By: Xaltar
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 2:40am
LLC settings are apparently not supported on the newer VRM controllers on Gaming X boards, I would tend to suspect the same may be true with newer revision Killer SLI boards by what you have written. From what I have seen these boards overclock virtually identically to previous gen boards (gaming K4/earlier Killer SLI). The impression I got from ASRock was that the setting was not necessary (and hence not supported) with these new controllers. I was not told this outright, much of the details of board specs and components is proprietary and not public knowledge (including us mods). 

I have the X370 Taichi and while I was initially able to get 4.05ghz stable it did not remain stable for long on my 1600x. I had to tune it down to 4.0 then eventually 3.9ghz for daily use. Ryzen CPUs do not seem to hit 4.0 and beyond as easily or as often as early reviews seem to indicate without pumping unsafe voltages into them. With a 240mm AIO on my system I find my CPU temps get a little too high with a vcore of anything over 1.395v, my VRMs also get hotter than I am comfortable with for 24/7 use.

If you are getting a lot of voltage droop, try positioning a fan over your VRM section for some extra cooling. VRM controllers are a lot more advanced these days and actually do throttle when overheated/loaded. My system has 2 140mm fans and 6 120mm fans installed with about a 40% to 60% exhaust to intake ratio. Just changing my fan profiles can improve stability at 4.0 on my system. I can technically run my system at 4.0 but temps are not what I consider ideal (I like my system fairly quiet). 

The Killer SLI, Gaming X and Pro series boards are not designed to give you maximum overclocking potential. Even my Gaming K4 can't live up to my Taichi. 3.9ghz is not a huge jump down from 4.0 anyway. I find gaming at 3.9 on my system is no different to 4.0 for example and the only place I see a more noteworthy performance increase is in synthetics like cinebench. 

Don't let the internet and "expected performance" figures ruin your enjoyment of your system. All too often it is easy to get caught up in getting X or Y overclock and A or B RAM speeds stable when the reality is, you won't even notice the difference between your overclocks vs the "ideal" 3200 and 4.0 everyone seems to think is somehow essential to even use the system..... I most often use my systems at stock after tinkering with OCs when the system is fresh and new. Once I have my benchmarks all buttoned down I just load defaults and enjoy my build. With Ryzen I do notice that 3.8+ seems to make a difference so I keep my build at 3.9 and my RAM at 3200 because it's stable there for me. Don't get caught up in the who's is bigger nonsense, enjoy what you purchased/built. Also bare in mind that AMD's AGESA is still evolving and will continue to do so, each update brings change, not always good it seems. Once AM4 is more mature things will settle and actual expected figures/OCs can be established. 


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Posted By: adsaidler
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 8:08am
Originally posted by Xaltar Xaltar wrote:

LLC settings are apparently not supported on the newer VRM controllers on Gaming X boards, I would tend to suspect the same may be true with newer revision Killer SLI boards by what you have written. From what I have seen these boards overclock virtually identically to previous gen boards (gaming K4/earlier Killer SLI). The impression I got from ASRock was that the setting was not necessary (and hence not supported) with these new controllers. I was not told this outright, much of the details of board specs and components is proprietary and not public knowledge (including us mods). 

I have the X370 Taichi and while I was initially able to get 4.05ghz stable it did not remain stable for long on my 1600x. I had to tune it down to 4.0 then eventually 3.9ghz for daily use. Ryzen CPUs do not seem to hit 4.0 and beyond as easily or as often as early reviews seem to indicate without pumping unsafe voltages into them. With a 240mm AIO on my system I find my CPU temps get a little too high with a vcore of anything over 1.395v, my VRMs also get hotter than I am comfortable with for 24/7 use.

If you are getting a lot of voltage droop, try positioning a fan over your VRM section for some extra cooling. VRM controllers are a lot more advanced these days and actually do throttle when overheated/loaded. My system has 2 140mm fans and 6 120mm fans installed with about a 40% to 60% exhaust to intake ratio. Just changing my fan profiles can improve stability at 4.0 on my system. I can technically run my system at 4.0 but temps are not what I consider ideal (I like my system fairly quiet). 

The Killer SLI, Gaming X and Pro series boards are not designed to give you maximum overclocking potential. Even my Gaming K4 can't live up to my Taichi. 3.9ghz is not a huge jump down from 4.0 anyway. I find gaming at 3.9 on my system is no different to 4.0 for example and the only place I see a more noteworthy performance increase is in synthetics like cinebench. 

Don't let the internet and "expected performance" figures ruin your enjoyment of your system. All too often it is easy to get caught up in getting X or Y overclock and A or B RAM speeds stable when the reality is, you won't even notice the difference between your overclocks vs the "ideal" 3200 and 4.0 everyone seems to think is somehow essential to even use the system..... I most often use my systems at stock after tinkering with OCs when the system is fresh and new. Once I have my benchmarks all buttoned down I just load defaults and enjoy my build. With Ryzen I do notice that 3.8+ seems to make a difference so I keep my build at 3.9 and my RAM at 3200 because it's stable there for me. Don't get caught up in the who's is bigger nonsense, enjoy what you purchased/built. Also bare in mind that AMD's AGESA is still evolving and will continue to do so, each update brings change, not always good it seems. Once AM4 is more mature things will settle and actual expected figures/OCs can be established. 

Xaltar, thanks a lot for the comprehensive explanation!

Even though the VRMs do not reach more than 80 something degrees, I'll try cooling them to see if it helps with the vdroop!

Thanks for the heads up regarding letting high expectations ruin my enjoyment.. I was really frustrated, and started regretting building a new PC.

If anything changes by cooling the VRMs, I'll let you guys know!



Posted By: adsaidler
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 9:35am
Direct cooling the VRMs reduced the temperature by 15c, but it did not do a thing for the vdroop.

3.95Ghz seems stable enough at 1.4v, but I'm not sure it is worth it over 3.9Ghz at 1.35625v. 
More testing is needed.

An official response from AsRock regarding their plans regarding LLC on the new revison of the X370 Killer would be a welcome and consumer-friendly move.


Posted By: Xaltar
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 5:06pm
I wouldn't hold your breath. Manufacturers (not just ASRock) usually keep their power design details under wraps. It is one of the largest determining factors when it comes to stability and overclocking, key elements when users select boards. 

I can say, if the newer revision Killer SLI boards utilize the same power design as the Gaming X then LLC will not be returned. It is physically not supported. However, if ASRock has chosen to use this design on another board (not just the Gaming X) then it has clearly passed their stringent in house testing and proven itself reliable for the segment it has been implemented for. Like I said, overclocking is not a selling point for boards in this range. The same is true of similarly priced boards from all manufacturers unless they have skimped in other areas to focus on overclocking. 

3.9 is perfectly acceptable with Ryzen, using something like a 1080ti the 100 mhz jump to 4.0 would only net you in the realms of 3 - 4fps at 1080p on high settings in most new AAA titles. Considering at this point you are well over 100fps anyway you are not going to even notice the difference. On a GTX 1080 or lower the difference would be practically non existent. Bare in mind that reviews are, by design, set up to force the bottleneck onto the component under review. In the case of a CPU this means GPU and RAM are maximized to increase workloads for the CPU. Unless you are using obscenely expensive GPU/s and RAM, you will not see the same benefits shown on a review system. 

Like I said before, the "whose is bigger" issue is a real problem today. Most reviewers do not outline the information I just did. Manufacturers sending them products want users to see the best possible performance that can be extracted not tell users that the lesser model is probably all you need. Some reviewers do break down value now which is a step in the right direction. 

The R7 1700 vs R7 1800x for example are physically identical save a few bits of code in the microcode changing frequencies and name (yes, the difference is in the firmware of the CPU, nowhere else). While in an ideal world the 1800x would be better binned and achieve higher clocks at lower voltages the reality is usually far from that. Demand will force higher binned chips to be branded with lower monikers, especially when manufacturing processes mature and defect rates are decreased. 

From my experience and reading many user accounts:

3.8ghz paired with a GTX 1080 is sufficient to get the most out of your system 
3.6ghz paired with a GTX 1070
Stock with anything less.

Also bare in mind this is for 1080p, as soon as you jump up to higher resolutions the GPU becomes the bottleneck in almost every instance. 

I think I did some stickies breaking this info down a while ago, I need to find them and update them again and maybe repost them in a few more sections. 

The only significant quirk of Ryzen is the RAM speed issue, it is not as severe as it has been made out to be but it is valid. Generally 2666 should be the go to speed for RAM on systems using a 1070 (or equivalent) or lower and 2933 for a GTX 1080 or higher. 3200 is neat but the tiny performance bump is not worth the additional cost vs an overclockable 2666 kit. 

Don't get caught up in getting specific figures, focus on the best balance of temps vs performance. Overclocking is about finding the balance between frequency and temps not breaking records and burning out your parts in half the time Wink Shooting for records or setting goals is not a game for the casual overclocker, a pro will go through a dozen motherboards, CPUs and GPUs for a record attempt. Many hardcore overclockers will purchase rebinned chips (tested by a 3rd party) that have been tested at high overclocks in store and cherry picked to deliver high clocks. These CPUs sell for hundreds of $$ more than the retail value. Stores like these will actually burn out a significant portion of the CPUs they test to find the golden silicon they then sell, the added cost is to cover this expense.

Honestly, the problem is how easy overclocking seems today with such simple options in the UEFI. Anyone can have a crack at it and sometimes you get lucky, after all, the CPUs sold for hundreds of $$ more still come from stores. Every casual overclocker dreams of getting one of these "lucky" chips or as the saying goes in the discipline "winning the silicon lottery". The term is quite apt Wink 


So, the TLDR:

Anything over 3.8 is a bonus and 3.8 should be enough to extract the most out of your GPU. If you want to challenge yourself and have some fun with your overclocking, try and see how low you can get your voltages at ~3.8/3.9 while still being stable. This is the most often overlooked conclusion of a proper overclocking session, finding the sweet spot for 24/7 use Wink


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Posted By: zlobster
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 7:28pm
More so, 24/7 under 1.4V Vcore and your Ryzen will bite the dust within a few months (rough estimation Big smile).

What Xaltar said is 100% true - gains from 3.8-4.0GHz are marginal except for a few benchmarks. If your intention was to render or crunch 24/7 under extreme speeds, then I'm afraid you choose the wrong platform for this.

Invest more time in faster RAM, it works wonders for Ryzens.


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1700X ZP-B1 (stock); X370 Taichi (UEFI 3.10); 16GB F4-3200C14-8GFX XMP; 256GB 960 EVO; RX 580 NITRO+ 8GB


Posted By: zlobster
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 8:01pm
Originally posted by adsaidler adsaidler wrote:

Originally posted by chainsaw chainsaw wrote:

if you can exchange the MOBO for a launch Rev. you can get LLC. Sad that ASRock is removing features on new revisions. When we look up reviews about the mobo they are often from early in the release cycle. when asrock removes features as time goes on it really does a dis-service to the end users.

That is the problem. I feel extremely mislead.


Welcome to the ASRock club! LOL


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1700X ZP-B1 (stock); X370 Taichi (UEFI 3.10); 16GB F4-3200C14-8GFX XMP; 256GB 960 EVO; RX 580 NITRO+ 8GB


Posted By: adsaidler
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 11:06pm
Originally posted by Xaltar Xaltar wrote:

Anything over 3.8 is a bonus and 3.8 should be enough to extract the most out of your GPU. If you want to challenge yourself and have some fun with your overclocking, try and see how low you can get your voltages at ~3.8/3.9 while still being stable. This is the most often overlooked conclusion of a proper overclocking session, finding the sweet spot for 24/7 use Wink

Thanks again for the input, Xaltar!

Just completed a 13 hour run of AIDA64 with the following results:
Core clock: 3.9GHz
CPU voltage: 1.3625v
Core voltage under load: 1.29v
Average temp: 69c (air conditioning on drops it by 10c; Brazil is really, really hot)
VRM temps: 80c

The last attempt at 3.95GHz was @1.4125v (1.36 under load) unstable, so I gave up. Totally not worth the extra voltage and temps (around 5c).

Overall I'm really satisfied with the results! Next up will be a 12-hour run of Prime95 and OCCT to assess stability and then I'll work on tightening the memory timings or increasing the clocks; Samsung B-die should give me some working room!

Thank you guys a lot for the feedback! :D




Posted By: adsaidler
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 11:10pm
Originally posted by zlobster zlobster wrote:

Originally posted by adsaidler adsaidler wrote:

Originally posted by chainsaw chainsaw wrote:

if you can exchange the MOBO for a launch Rev. you can get LLC. Sad that ASRock is removing features on new revisions. When we look up reviews about the mobo they are often from early in the release cycle. when asrock removes features as time goes on it really does a dis-service to the end users.

That is the problem. I feel extremely mislead.


Welcome to the ASRock club! LOL

I'll keep this in mind when time comes to purchase my next motherboard, or give advice to friends.

However, the price was extremely good at black friday, making it cheaper than lots of B350 boards, so I still feel like I got a lot o value for the money invested.

Looks are awesome too on my black and white build! :D


Posted By: Xaltar
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 11:37pm
Originally posted by adsaidler adsaidler wrote:

However, the price was extremely good at black friday, making it cheaper than lots of B350 boards, so I still feel like I got a lot o value for the money invested.

Looks are awesome too on my black and white build! :D

This is where ASRock shines, value for money Wink Get a good deal on top of that and you really score. 

On top of all that, there is no way of knowing if your CPU can even reach 4.0 to begin with, no matter the board, a lot of Ryzen CPUs can't. This is why I said overclocking should be focused on getting the most out of your particular system without sacrificing thermals, wherever you land, you land. In all my years of overclocking I have only ever gotten one good CPU that met (and exceeded) my expectations, all the others (I build PCs for a living so this is a LOT) have narrowly missed my goals or failed to come close at all. Eventually I wised up and realized that literally any overclock is free performance and more than I paid for. Change the way you look at it and you will no longer be disappointed and actually enjoy the process. 

I have been overclocking for a very long time, I have felt your frustration many times, especially when I started out. Eventually I mellowed out and realized how little that extra X or Y mhz really meant and how little performance it amounted to. Remember this, you have an 8 core 16 thread monster on your desk that kicks ass and takes names, even at stock Wink

Good luck with the RAM, I hate setting up RAM, it can be so tedious Confused I managed 3500 on my 3600 RAM with my Taichi then the next BIOS update killed that and I couldn't get 3200 stable then I got 3200 with the next update...... It wasn't my board or ASRock it was the damned AGESA code, I have never had such headaches with my RAM before. If you can get anything over 2666 you are doing good, 3200 or more and you are sitting pretty for sure Wink I pushed my system to the absolute limits for the review I wrote on the board, usually I don't go to so much effort.

Happy Holidays and congrats on your new beast Big smile 


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Posted By: adsaidler
Date Posted: 31 Dec 2017 at 1:52am
Thanks for making me look at this situation from another, more positive, perspective!

I'm preparing my stomach to deal with the RAM later. Guess I won't even have the time, since I still have to complete runs of OCCT, Real Bench and some Battlefield 1 to consider it stable enough for my needs!

Happy Holidays to you guys, and I can't wait to get everything in order to finally play some Battlefield 1 on this machine. My i5 3570k @4.5Ghz was providing really poor .1% lows, even though the maximum reached between 90-100fps!

Cheers!


Posted By: chainsaw
Date Posted: 31 Dec 2017 at 2:57am
some food for thought. my OC of 4ghz is stable* doing prime95 and aida64 all gaming all day and night. BUT it is infact not stable and will crash doing Handbrake or video editing. my real "stable" oc is only 3.75ghz any more with even 1.45v does not pass the realwork Encoding/editing. Most games i play don't bottleneck my 2x GTX1080's in sli even at 3.75ghz. 

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ASRock Fatal1ty X370 Gaming K4 P3.40
AMD RYZEN 7 1700 @ 4Ghz 1.39v
Noctua NH-D15 "blocks top 1x pci-e"
16GB GSkill Ripjaw V F4-3200C16D-16GVRB @ 2933 14-15-15-15 T1 1.365v
GTX 1080 x2 Sli


Posted By: markp
Date Posted: 07 Jan 2018 at 11:17am
Originally posted by zlobster zlobster wrote:

More so, 24/7 under 1.4V Vcore and your Ryzen will bite the dust within a few months (rough estimation Big smile).

What Xaltar said is 100% true - gains from 3.8-4.0GHz are marginal except for a few benchmarks. If your intention was to render or crunch 24/7 under extreme speeds, then I'm afraid you choose the wrong platform for this.

Invest more time in faster RAM, it works wonders for Ryzens.


I am going to call bull$hit on this, dust within a few months my a$$.  I have been running 1.45 v-core on my R7 1700 for months (since May 2017) at 3.95 to 4.0 GHz (although the highest "stable" clock is 3.975, took me months to be able to get it to run benchmarks at 4.0 GHz).   It will run all day at 3.975 GHz (depending on the BIOS version - the latest BIOS made me drop to 3.95 GHz to have the reliability I wanted).

That said, my rig is water-cooled, which I am sure helps.  I also have a separate fan blowing directly over the VRM to ensure that the temps remain well below the rated capacities.  Getting past 4.0 GHz, my unlucky R7 1700 CPU will balk nearly every time (where my "good" R5 1400 will run 4.1 GHz on air cooling!).  I might add that none of my Ryzen's which are ALL clocked at or above 1.40 v-core have been rock solid 24/7 (2 air-cooled 1400's 3.85 GHz and 4.05 GHz and 1 water-cooled R7 1700 at 3.95 GHz).

Does it place these CPU's at risk of early failure, sure, no doubt it does.  Is it a matter of turning them into dust "in a few months"?  Not even close.  Control the temps and the hardware will certainly last longer (and perhaps with much less risk than commonly thought).

Is my data anecdotal and an insufficient sample size, yes, but it is data which suggests that Ryzen might tolerate more voltage over time than some might believe.  FWIW, I might be bottlenecking my GPU's but that's two 1080ti's in SLI - at which point, who cares.  One last note, I maxed out the ram at 3333, but the timings were really loose.  Performance was much better on the Samsung B-Die running 13-14-14-14-28-40-1 timings at 3200 MT/s  (260-192-118 tRFC)




Posted By: wardog
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2018 at 2:36am
Busy at home and late to the game here but............

Two new X370 Killer SLI/AC BIOSes just released on Jan 16 2018.

Must be done in order.

3.50 FIRST

Then 4.50



4.50: AGESA PinnaclePI-AM4 1.0.0.0




Posted By: wardog
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2018 at 2:52am
Originally posted by markp markp wrote:


Is my data anecdotal and an insufficient sample size, yes, but it is data which suggests that Ryzen might tolerate more voltage over time than some might believe.


Water cooling does help with temps. ie: voltage related excessive temps

But otherwise, I'm going with you stating anecdotal. It is still somewhat early to definitively state such as anything but as personal experiences yet.


.


Posted By: adsaidler
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2018 at 3:03am
Originally posted by wardog wardog wrote:

Busy at home and late to the game here but............

Two new X370 Killer SLI/AC BIOSes just released on Jan 16 2018.

Must be done in order.

3.50 FIRST

Then 4.50



4.50: AGESA PinnaclePI-AM4 1.0.0.0



Thanks for the heads up! I'll install it when possible!


Posted By: augustobotossi
Date Posted: 19 Jan 2018 at 12:10am
Originally posted by adsaidler adsaidler wrote:

Originally posted by zlobster zlobster wrote:

Originally posted by adsaidler adsaidler wrote:

Originally posted by chainsaw chainsaw wrote:

if you can exchange the MOBO for a launch Rev. you can get LLC. Sad that ASRock is removing features on new revisions. When we look up reviews about the mobo they are often from early in the release cycle. when asrock removes features as time goes on it really does a dis-service to the end users.

That is the problem. I feel extremely mislead.


Welcome to the ASRock club! LOL

I'll keep this in mind when time comes to purchase my next motherboard, or give advice to friends.

However, the price was extremely good at black friday, making it cheaper than lots of B350 boards, so I still feel like I got a lot o value for the money invested.

Looks are awesome too on my black and white build! :D

We are kind in the same boat then, I got this board at BF too and I am seeing the same thing. I am running my R7 1700 @3,6Ghz 1.1875V, but when stress testing, HWINfo shows a max Vcore of 1.131V. 0.044 is marginal, I know, but LLC would be put to some good use right now. I am using the stock cooler, so I am taking OC slow right now.


Posted By: augustobotossi
Date Posted: 19 Jan 2018 at 12:17am
Originally posted by wardog wardog wrote:

Busy at home and late to the game here but............

Two new X370 Killer SLI/AC BIOSes just released on Jan 16 2018.

Must be done in order.

3.50 FIRST

Then 4.50



4.50: AGESA PinnaclePI-AM4 1.0.0.0



I upgraded but returned to 3.40. I had several issues with this new RAM. I was running my RAM micron @2933Mhz 1.275V, but with this new BIOS it responded with continuous shot beeps until I powered the system holding the power button. Also, if doing OC with p-states is your thing, you must chose the AMD CBS OC option. However, that closes the XMP options too and OCing the RAM gets complicated. And, the other situation I found is that the mobo gets the RAM voltage resetting to 1.20V (im my case), so it's not helping at all.



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