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Z170 Extreme 4: DP1.2 and TB at the same time?

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EvilDragon View Drop Down
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    Posted: 31 Jan 2017 at 9:00pm
Hello!

So I have my Z170 Extreme4 running nicely, I also got the Thunderbolt AIC card, which I am using to connect my RME UFX+ audio interface - everything works splendidly!

Now, I'd like to know, in case I decide to do this one day, how would I connect a DisplayPort 1.2 monitor while retaining the Thunderbolt connectivity? I read in TB AIC specs that it supports DP Multi-Stream Transport, which I assume means it allows daisy-chaining multiple DisplayPort peripherials.

So, my question would be: how would I daisy-chain this? Would I need a sort of a splitter from motherboard's DisplayPort BEFORE it hits the AIC card, or would I need some sort of a splitter/converter from TB to DP? Links to relevant cables/hardware would be very nice!


Thanks!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wardog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Jan 2017 at 10:00pm
You lost me there.

TB can transport PCIe data, or a DisplayPort signal, yet not both at the same time.

Why daisy chain a monitor into a storage chain? A storage chain consists of full width/both channels of PCIe data going both ways. To introduced a DP signal would render one TB channel useless for storage, thus negating the FULL benefit of the TB channel being used for storage.

Both the motherboard/CPU and most all new graphics card worth a pinch of salt will have DP to connect your monitor to.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wardog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Jan 2017 at 10:15pm
Originally posted by wardog wardog wrote:

TB can transport PCIe data, or a DisplayPort signal, yet not both at the same time.


Allow me to clarify.

A single TB channel can transmit PCIe data, or a DisplayPort signal, yet not both at the same time.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote parsec Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Jan 2017 at 10:44pm
Originally posted by EvilDragon EvilDragon wrote:

Hello!

So I have my Z170 Extreme4 running nicely, I also got the Thunderbolt AIC card, which I am using to connect my RME UFX+ audio interface - everything works splendidly!

Now, I'd like to know, in case I decide to do this one day, how would I connect a DisplayPort 1.2 monitor while retaining the Thunderbolt connectivity? I read in TB AIC specs that it supports DP Multi-Stream Transport, which I assume means it allows daisy-chaining multiple DisplayPort peripherials.

So, my question would be: how would I daisy-chain this? Would I need a sort of a splitter from motherboard's DisplayPort BEFORE it hits the AIC card, or would I need some sort of a splitter/converter from TB to DP? Links to relevant cables/hardware would be very nice!


Thanks!


Connecting multiple devices to a Thunderbolt card depends upon the connections the other devices have, and if they provide the daisy chaining ability themselves.

Otherwise, as the ASRock Thunderbolt 2 AIC card page shows, you'll need a Thunderbolt dock (sorry for the text link, some URLs don't work with the forum editor's link tool):

http://www.asrock.com/mb/spec/card.asp?Model=Thunderbolt%202%20AIC

While that page calls them "hubs", Thunderbolt hubs apparently don't exist yet. What does exist are Thunderbolt docks, which are powered, active devices. Hubs imply passive, or simple dumb devices. Examples of Thunderbolt docks with more information:

http://thewirecutter.com/reviews/best-thunderbolt-dock/

Cables depend upon the required interfaces of each device, and the dock itself. I don't own any Thunderbolt hardware, so I don't have personal experience with it.






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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote EvilDragon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Feb 2017 at 2:02am
@wardog: I don't WANT to have a graphics card since my CPU is already doing it well and supports 4K as well. It just adds noise, and I'm not a gamer, I do music production, so the more silent the computer case, the better. Also, I'm not daisy-chaining into a storage chain. My audio interface is connected through TB. But, for this to work, I need to sacrifice DisplayPort on my motherboard, which AIC card converts to TB.

My question still stands. I don't need a TB dock. I need to use DisplayPort on my motherboard BOTH for the 4K monitor I might get one day (which only supports max resolution at 60 Hz using DP 1.2, not HDMI or anything else), and I need to keep my audio interface connected to TB.

Hence my query here :)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote EvilDragon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Feb 2017 at 2:33am
Ehhh, looks like this won't work, because the monitor I was eyeing (Dell P4317Q) doesn't support DP daisy-chaining. Shucks...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wardog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Feb 2017 at 6:35am
Conundrum vs Rock and a hard place.



You don't req a "serious" $$$ graphics card then, right?

I can say, from my Sig below, that the 1050ti runs silent. Heck, the fans don't spin most times. And is more that capable for what your needs seem.

Which I can say of the 1070 there too, but thats back to $$$.

1050ti's can be had here in the US for around $160



Just a thought and maybe some idea





Edited by wardog - 01 Feb 2017 at 6:37am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote parsec Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Feb 2017 at 11:49am
Originally posted by EvilDragon EvilDragon wrote:

Ehhh, looks like this won't work, because the monitor I was eyeing (Dell P4317Q) doesn't support DP daisy-chaining. Shucks...


As I said in my previous post, the ability to daisy chain devices with Thunderbolt depends on the devices being used.

Devices specifically designed for use with Thunderbolt may have the extra IO connection(s), but that should always be checked. Since those devices are not common (yet), we have Thunderbolt docks or hubs.

Most monitors IMO never even have enough inputs, the chances of most of them having a Thunderbolt output is close to zero. Apple would be the main source of that type of monitor.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote EvilDragon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Feb 2017 at 6:30pm
Yeah, I'm not crazy about paying the big bucks to Apple... That Dell monitor actually DOES have a fair amount of inputs (its main feature being able to show 4 DIFFERENT signals at the same time at 1080p!)... just no DP daisy chaining... Is this possibly because 4K at 3840x2160 and 60 Hz takes up a lot of DP bandwidth, so there's no bandwidth to leave for other possible DP devices in the chain? Seems that way.


Originally posted by wardog wardog wrote:

Conundrum vs Rock and a hard place.

You don't req a "serious" $$$ graphics card then, right?

I can say, from my Sig below, that the 1050ti runs silent. Heck, the fans don't spin most times. And is more that capable for what your needs seem.

Which I can say of the 1070 there too, but thats back to $$$.

1050ti's can be had here in the US for around $160

Just a thought and maybe some idea


Yeah, I don't need it for my current purposes (i7-6700K graphics working very nicely with 1920x1200@60 Hz dual monitor setup here), but if I want to upgrade to a single 4K monitor at a later date, it looks like I'm going to need a QUIET, passively cooled GPU (because that's how I like my GPUs, no fans) that can run 4K@60Hz over DP 1.2 then, that doesn't cost an arm and a leg... If such a thing even exists.


Thanks for ideas, guys.


Edited by EvilDragon - 01 Feb 2017 at 6:32pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Xaltar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Feb 2017 at 9:51pm
The GTX 1050ti will do exactly what you need as Wardog mentioned. Even the non ti version would be more than adequate. I couldn't find a passive cooled version available but that isn't a concern anyway, all you would need to do is get one with a beefy cooling solution, without gaming loads the fans will never come on. My GTX 960's fans only come on after 20mins of gaming and never under non gaming loads, including watching 4k video (down-sampled which takes more resources on the GPU).
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