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Please suggest RAM for z97 pro4

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    Posted: 08 Sep 2015 at 4:08pm
I'm thrilled you figured that out car313!! Thumbs Up

Power supply problems can be terrible to find, except by trying another power supply! I'm glad you trusted yourself by trying your small Antec PSU, it should be (and was) fine for the testing you did.

Antec, like most power supply companies, does not manufacture them themselves. Antec has used only the best OEMs for their higher end PSUs, like Superflower and Delta, and probably Seasonic too. So depending upon the model you purchased, it should be a good to great unit.

It seems like my theory was right, something in the bad PSU would fail after the PSU was on for about ten minutes after a cold start. Then the PC would fail to restart after that, which makes sense.

I want to verify that was the scenario as a learning experience, the symptoms of a faulty PSU that repeated the same behavior, given the same initial conditions.

I'd enjoy testing that PSU when it fails, to see what actually happens. That is, if one of the three DC rails went out of range/spec on its voltage. It seems the fault was not enough to cause the protection circuitry of the unit to shut it off, which would have made the diagnosis much easier.

If it is still under warranty you might be able to get a replacement.

Good luck with that PC in the future, visit us here anytime you like! And thanks for the beer Beer
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Xaltar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2015 at 3:22am
That is great news Car313 Thumbs Up

You should be able to return the defective power supply for a full refund and an Antec PSU, while not as good a brand as Seasonic is still a good brand so you should be fine with it. Sadly even the best brands sometimes have duds.

The new cooler is not strictly needed on a non overclocked system but you may as well go with it for better cooling. You can go ahead and shut down the PC and put your other parts in, 2 hours would have been plenty of time to test for problems so after 10 you are golden Wink Just be sure to take your time and be careful not to rush, it is so easy to go too fast and get careless once the excitement kicks in Embarrassed

Let us know how it all runs once you have it up and running Cool
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote car313 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2015 at 12:50am
dearest xalter and parsec

everything is all right!!!!!!

i am so very very very happy!. relieved i should say, the relief is worth the tension!! i would never have known what to do without you guys! i really wish i could buy you guys a beer if you are not teetotallers!!

i just connected an old antec 400 watts psu and you know what! its up and running!

as of the time of this typing the thing (mobo+ram, 1 8gb stick+processor+heat sink+monitor) has been up for about 10 hours. i decided to let it run for 2 hours more before i shut it down and re-start it tomorrow morning. it is about 10.20 in the night here. the voltages (in the hardware monitor page of the uefi) are only occasionally (maybe once in twenty to thirty seconds) changing and the processor temp is between 47.0 and 47.5 degrees celsius all the while. we are having a bit of a cool weather here and after a slight drizzle, the air temp is 28 degrees celsius.

i am tempted to shut the thing down, connect the rest of its entrails and install the os. but i am going to wait. for sweet, sweet revenge!

i will shut it down after a couple of hours and wait until morning tomorrow. just to get it back to a cold cold state.

i borrowed (with some difficulty) a smps with a 24 pin atx connector as well as a 4 pin 12 volt connector. i connected this psu and booted the the thing. the thing has been going on from about 12 nnoon. as it has been going on for so long, i am wondering whether to cancel the proprietary heat sink i ordered. or maybe i should just let it arrive and then adorn the processor with it!

i decided to go ahead with another psu. this borrowed one happens to be an antec. so i decided to sail with it. i think i will order an antec 500 watts psu and then i should be fine.

your suspicion turned out right. the psu WAS the problem. thanks a lot guys!

i love you guys man!!


Edited by car313 - 08 Sep 2015 at 12:54am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote car313 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Sep 2015 at 10:40am
dear parsec
that one hour uptime was just once. it never happened again.

as of now the established pattern is -
cold start -> 5 to 8 minutes -> reboot -> 5 to 6 seconds -> reboot . . . . . .

i know that xalter would deprecate it, but i just want to ask. i am not going to do anything rash by myself without first asking.

would it damage the z97 pro4 if i just tried it for ten minutes or so with an old working psu. except that this old psu has a 20 pin atx and a 4 pin atx connector. keeping to the latched orientation, there would be 4 empty places on the motherboard while 20 would be occupied. while the 4 pin would go into the 8 pin on the motherboard with four unoccupied. i closely verified the pattern on the mating parts and they match. IF (i am not going to do anything like that, but just curious) i did this, would i be "frying" or "cooking" something on the mother board or the processor or the ram?

regards
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote parsec Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Sep 2015 at 2:13am
I was afraid that the heatsink mounting was not the problem. Confused

car313, I don't think a UPS unit will help with your problem, unless you know the electrical service in your area is poor.

I'm out of ideas besides the power supply itself. It seems as if you start from a cold start of the PC, the system will work for about an hour, and then go into the restart cycle.

I'm wondering if the PSU has a bad component that begins to fail after the PSU runs for a while, and the part warms up. Then it fails in some way, and the restarts begin.

Since that seems to be consistent, given what you've told us, I really wish you could try another PSU, if only to eliminate that as a cause.

Also trying to think why the board itself would act in that way. All I can think of is the CPU VRMs overheating for some reason, but that normally is not a problem when in the UEFI UI.

Still thinking... Geek
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote car313 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Sep 2015 at 11:08pm
dear guys
i re-did the heat sink mounting procedure without the mistakes pointed out by parsec.

but no effect.

i will order one of the cpu coolers suggested by xalter and then get back. also in the meanwhile i will get an uninteruptible power supply unit. 

i am humbled by the readiness with which you guys share your insights.

with thw best regards
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Xaltar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Sep 2015 at 8:27pm
If it made you smile then it was probably a present from the tech gods to make up for all your woes :)

Try with the stock cooler again but be sure it is firmly attached to the board. It should be tight on the CPU to the point where there is no wiggle. It is possible that the CPU is operating at ~58c when idling in BIOS and shooting up to thermal shutdown temps as soon as the BIOS polls the system for info. This kind of sharp rise can happen quicker than the polling intervals of the BIOS hw monitor (usually every 1 - 2 seconds). 

If you are wanting a solid cooler I would recommend the Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo, it is very solid air cooler and quite popular among enthusiast users. It is a bit of an overkill for a system that will not be overclocked but given you are in India where it gets hot and humid it will be useful for those times you are not using an air conditioner. If you are after something a little smaller and cheaper I can recommend the Arctic Cooling Freezer 13, I have used this cooler myself and it is fantastic for its size and price.

Good luck Car313, lets hope we have found your problem and that you can get it sorted now Smile

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote car313 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Sep 2015 at 6:00pm
dear guys,
the hell with the intel hetsink, i absolutely don't mind ditching this heatsink and getting myself a seperate one. shall i go ahead? just suggest me a good one. and i will.

but for all that when the sysytem reboots, the temp at the most is 55 to 58 degreed celsius. do you think the processor will restart at that temp? this is about half way to 90 celsius.

i just removed the heatsink and this time will get it right. i hope i can come back with some happy news. and i sure hope this solves my problem.

with warm regards.

ps. there WAS. i swear a beauty sitting in a seventies model open top car! i swear! it even looked to me like the good old mustang ford! exactly where parsec had posted a picture of of the label on the psu.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Xaltar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Sep 2015 at 4:28pm
Good spot there Parsec, I completely missed that. It may well be the cause of the problem, especially if the cooler isn't sitting tight against the CPU. I am going to be so happy if this is the problem :)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote parsec Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Sep 2015 at 4:00pm
I just noticed this in a post by car313, at the top of page 6 of this thread. I just copied the text rather than quoting.

"the issues in particular are:
the cpu cooler plastic supports are just about equal to the height of the heatsink profile. so as soon as you try placing the heatsink, it smears the paste. with attempts to push the feet in and turn them, much smearing has already taken place.
the plastic supports are quite flimsy and even after being firmly seated, there is some play between the four holes on the mobo and the expanded feet of the plastic supports."

This is a description of mounting the stock Intel CPU cooler. The first thing that troubles me is the, "... push the feet in and turn them".

If I'm understanding this correctly, you are doing it wrong. Turning the push pin's head is only done when removing the cooler. When you mount it you should not be turning anything, only pushing in the four push pins.

I'm guessing you turned the four push pin heads to remove the cooler, that is fine. You turn it to the unlock position, and pull up. But BEFORE you mount the cooler again, you must turn the head of each push pin back from the unlock position.

It sounds like you are pushing the push pin into place, and then turning it from the unlocked position. I can't predict what happens when that is done, but given what you said next, it seems to not work correctly.

That was this: "there is some play between the four holes on the mobo and the expanded feet of the plastic supports".

There should be no play at all between cooler mounting holes and the expanded push pins, or the top of the mother board and the contact pad on each push pin. I'm wondering if we have a simple CPU overheating problem caused by a bad CPU cooler mount.

Sorry car313, I can't see how your CPU cooler is mounted and I can only know what you tell us. It has been a long time since I used a stock Intel CPU cooler, but I'm pretty sure it should not be loose, have play between it and the board, or be able to twist it a bit from side to side.

If you were having an CPU over heating problem, you would see the CPU temperature in the H/W Monitor screen go a bit above 100C, and then the CPU would start throttling itself in an attempt to reduce its temperature. A processor runs at its full speed when using the BIOS UI, its power saving features (if enabled) are not active when in the BIOS. Eventually if the CPU did not cool off, or the BIOS crashes because of the lower CPU speed, the PC restarts. You would need to watch the CPU temperature in the H/W Monitor screen to see if it goes that high.

Just another theory regarding what your problem is. Confused

This scared me too... for a little while:

and thanks for your last photograph of a bombshell. sometimes (such as this time) i wish i was younger! she made my day! ;)

I was worried I download the wrong picture somehow, nothing like that on this PC. Cool

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