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Z170 Extreme4: Monitor show no picture - sometimes
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6502 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 02 Nov 2016 at 9:20pm
Hello all,

new self-built PC with (all new bought components):

- Z170 Extreme4
- Intel Skylake Pentium G4500 
- Built-in HD Graphics 530 connected to Hyundai W241D monitor (built in 2008)
- no additional graphics card, no other PCIe cards
- 2x8 GB memory
- bequiet  Case & Power Supply (STRAIGHT POWER 10 500W CM)
- SATA hard disk
- newest BIOS 7.X
- Windows 7 64bit

The Hyundai monitor has several inputs: DVI, HDMI, VGA, Component. The input can be selected manually via hardware key. The monitor shows a red LED if no signal is connected to the chosen input (and also displays an on-screen message that no signal was detected). The LED goes blue if a correct signal was detected.

If I now connect the new PC to either HDMI or DVI input, I don't see the power-on BIOS copyright message (written in white text) .... In this case, the monitor LED is blue - which means that it detects a correct signal (an in the OSD, I can see the correct resolution displayed) ... but the screen stays black.

If I now disconnect all boot medias, I see the graphical BIOS screen. Sometimes it seems that I have to switch the monitor one time off and then on again to see the boot screen ... 

I tried all 3 outputs of the mainboard: DVI, HDMI and DisplayPort (with a Displayport to HDMI cable). No one shows the first text message of the BIOS at power-up.

A Windows 7 Setup DVD or an Unbuntu DVD starts ... but the screen stays black (and the monitor power LED stays blue - which means: signal detected...)


If I now connect the PC to my Panasonic LCD TV (built around 2014) via HDMI (same cable as used with the Hyundai monitor), all is fine: I see the white text message at the power up (with the Press Fx for Setup message) ... I see the graphical BIOS SETUP screen ... I can install & run Windows 7 (64 bit). 


This would mean: my Hyundai monitor is defective ..... but: the monitor still works fine with:
- a Lenovo T500 Thinkpad connected thru dock via DVI input
- a RasPi3  connected via HDMI

So the monitor works!

My guess:
As I use the Intel HD graphics 530 built into the Pentium G4500 processor, it seems that somehow this "graphics card" doesn't work in combination with this (8 years old) monitor ... maybe some signal levels to week if using an integrated graphics card?

Or is the Pentium G4500 defective (but... no, it works very well: I could install Windows 7 by using the Panasonic TV ...).

Or my Asrock mainboard?

Or is the Hyundai monitor defective in a way that results to not working with Skylake Pentium G4500 integrated graphics...? Or maybe not defective, but incompatible...

---> I could not test another "computer" monitor or a PCIe graphics card (instead of the processor integrated GPU) till now, because I don't own no other monitor & PC.


Does anybody have a clue which part (Hyundai monitor, mainboard, G4500 CPU/GPU) could be the cause of this strange behaviour?

Solution...? --> I could by a new monitor ... or a new dedicated PCIe graphics card ... but first, I need to know what is the most likely reason that it does not work with the already existing hardware...









Edited by 6502 - 02 Nov 2016 at 9:23pm
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wardog View Drop Down
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Drop back to the  pre 7.x BIOS.

The 7.x BIOSes are for Kaby Lake processors and many users have reported various issues using the Kaby Lake compatible BIOSes.
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parsec View Drop Down
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Points: 4996 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote parsec Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Nov 2016 at 11:46pm
I don't recall anyone having an issue the Intel integrated graphics like you are having.

Your description of the situation is very good, but the somewhat inconsistent nature of the issue makes it more difficult to figure out. Plus the PC's graphics work fine with a TV.

To be 100% clear, it is only at the start up (and restart/reboot??) that the Hyundai monitor stays black. At some point there will be an image on the screen, and you can use the PC normally, is that right?

Given what you've described, I would tend to think it is the Hyundai monitor that is the problem, in the sense that it is not compatible for some reason with the Intel Skylake graphics. Or partially not compatible. More testing is needed to reach a conclusion.

The point wardog made about the 7.00 Kaby Lake UEFI/BIOS version (for your board) is worth trying, meaning going back to the 3.40 UEFI. We've seen a few weird problems on some Z170 boards with these UEFI versions, which may be an Intel problem with this update. Another mobo manufacture had to reissue all of their Kaby Lake UEFI/BIOS versions, due to problems. Did you ever use your Z170 PC with that monitor without the 7.00 UEFI installed?

I know you've tried different cables when you tried different inputs and outputs, but unless you are always using the same cables throughout your testing, then a cable problem might still be the cause, however unlikely.

Can you test the Z170 Extreme4 PC with the Lenovo T500 Thinkpad as the monitor? The more you can test that PC with other "monitors", will add more examples of it working or not working. If you discover the only monitor that has a problem is the Hyundai, then it is probable that it has a compatibility issue with the Intel graphics.

The monitor may work as you said, but it might be having a problem locking onto the video signal from the Intel graphics, or other parts of it circuitry are beginning to go bad. DVI to DVI, HDMI to HDMI, and DisplayPort to DisplayPort are digital signal interfaces, that use low voltage signals.



Edited by parsec - 02 Nov 2016 at 11:46pm
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Thanks for your answer!

Originally posted by parsec parsec wrote:

To be 100% clear, it is only at the start up (and restart/reboot??) that the Hyundai monitor stays black. At some point there will be an image on the screen, and you can use the PC normally, is that right?

When connected to the Hyundai monitor, i only get a picture if the board jumps into the BIOS setup screen (like here: https://www.pierschel.com/images/XP941Boot/EFIBIOSBootScreen-Large.png).

I never see the first text message with BIOS copyright & Press Fxx-key messages (like here: http://s1.postimg.org/b5pe2z82n/DSC02734.jpg%20  )

(I also don't see the 2-lines text message which tells me to insert a valid boot media & press ENTER  if I only connect an empty hard disk.)

I also don't see Windows 7 booting & Windows 7 Desktop..... 

....but I can connect from my Thinkpad because I installed UltraVNC on the new PC when it was connected to the Panasoniv TV ... and then I can work fine with the new PC over VNC - so mainboard, RAM & CPU should be ok.  

(First i hoped that after installing Win 7, I would get a picture on the Hyundai, because Win 7 then switches to the higher resolution ... and the Hyundai only has problems with the VGA resolution at startup...but nope)

Windows 7 even offers a Windows update for my Hyundai monitor, if I connect it to the new PC (always with blue LED = on and Screen = black on Hyundai , which means: signal detected) and shows the name of the monitor in the display settings (which means that the Display Data Channel on HDMI/DVI cable works). Windows 7 also detects the correct 1920 x 1200 resolution of the monitor.

 
And now the strange thing what leads me to the conclusion that the monitor is the problem:

In the first run, I only connected the new PC to the Hyundai. I got no picture. I then simply tried to boot with a Win 7 SETUP DVD with the hope that the setup prog somehow does a better init of the Intel integrated graphics card than the BIOS ... the PC booted the Win 7 DVD ... after some time, the DVD drive stopped.

I then switched of the Hyundai monitor ... switched it on again ... and ... voila: I saw the Windows 7 SETUP screen prompting me for the desired languages of keyboard etc....  (But because I did not yet know tat I have to do some actions because Win 7 Setup can not handle USB 3.0 connected keyboards & mice, I had to stop and switch it off)

I then got a picture of Windows 7 one or two times again doing this switch-Hyundai-off/on trick... but now, this trick does not work any more. Installed Windows 7 boots, Hyundai LED is blue, but screen is black. VNC connection shows Win 7 logon screen.

Maybe the Hyundai - 8 years old - starts to become "defective"... Maybe the capacitors in the Hyundai get old / weak... maybe lower signal level on the Intel iGPU than on the Thinkpad T500 (which has an ATI GPU) ... and both factors together lead to "works with Thinkpad, but not with Intel iGPU...




Originally posted by parsec parsec wrote:


Did you ever use your Z170 PC with that monitor without the 7.00 UEFI installed?

Yes, I only flashed BIOS 1 with 7.00 and did not copy it over to BIOS 2 yet. This still is on lower level (some 3.x if I remember correctly).

--> The error also happens when I boot with the older BIOS 2.


Originally posted by parsec parsec wrote:


I know you've tried different cables when you tried different inputs and outputs, but unless you are always using the same cables throughout your testing, then a cable problem might still be the cause, however unlikely.

Same cable works on Panasonic TV, but not on Hyundai. I used 2 different HDMI cable and 1 Displayport-to-HDMI cable with both. 

One DVI cable was used with the Hyundai only (TV has no DVI): T500 works, new PC with Intel iGPU does not.


Originally posted by parsec parsec wrote:


Can you test the Z170 Extreme4 PC with the Lenovo T500 Thinkpad as the monitor? 

No, because the T500 has no input for the integrated Laptop LCD (the T500 is used stand-alone and in conjunction with the Hyundai, which works perfect).


Originally posted by parsec parsec wrote:

The more you can test that PC with other "monitors", will add more examples of it working or not working. If you discover the only monitor that has a problem is the Hyundai, then it is probable that it has a compatibility issue with the Intel graphics. 

I also think so...

I will try to organize another monitor for testing, but this can not happen before next week.


I also thought about contacting Hyundai, but it seems that "Hyundai IT" stopped selling computer monitors - at least in Europe or Germany. 




Edited by 6502 - 03 Nov 2016 at 2:10am
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Points: 5 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 6502 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Nov 2016 at 2:11am
Originally posted by wardog wardog wrote:

Drop back to the  pre 7.x BIOS.

Tested, but also does not work...
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