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Z97 extreme6 slooooow boot
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jglynn43 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 17 Sep 2015 at 9:28am
OK I hope someone out there knows what is going on with this. I'm on my second Z97 extreme6 MB (the first was actually an ac board but I re-used the wifi mini board on the second). Both boards were set up just plain vanilla, no overclocking or tweaking and worked great with 2-3 second boots everytime. After some time (two months with board 1, one WEEK with board 2), on a reboot USB went away and boot time went to around 90 seconds. When I say boot time, I mean the time to boot into the OS loader. And when I say the USB went away, I mean none of the USB ports, except for the ASMedia ones, no longer had any power.

Since I only have a keyboard and mouse plugged into the USB ports, I don't think it's because I'm pulling too much power on that circuit. Why did I get another? I didn't see it happen the first time. The PC had shutdown and I wasn't sure what happened. The second time I watched the LED go dark on my mouse, never to light up again on that port.

What gives?
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parsec View Drop Down
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Points: 4996 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote parsec Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Sep 2015 at 3:44pm
I have a Z97 Extreme6, and have never had your problems.

What Intel USB port(s) did you use, those on the IO panel or on the PC case via the USB headers on the board? Were they USB 2.0 ports, or USB 3.0?

What mouse are you using?

My guess about your problem is you have blown the fuses in the USB ports power channel/connection. There are small, non-user replaceable fuses on the board to protect the board and device connected to the USB ports from over current draw. There are specs for the maximum current draw on the USB ports, USB 3.0 has higher power specs than USB 2.0.

You would need to closely examine the areas on the board where the fuses would be, located somewhere near the USB ports. You would likely need a magnifying glass to find the fuses unless they left a tiny by visible burn mark. I don't know the exact location of the fuses on the board.

Why the fuses are blowing (IF that is correct) is another question. It seems you've had this happen now on two of these boards? Many possibilities, the first thing I would consider is the mouse itself. If a wired mouse, any possible wires shorting anywhere in the cable? Could be near either end or internally to the mouse.

Another thing is the metal plate that covers the connections on the IO panel, that comes with the board. The plate has small metal tabs on it that are meant to contact the outside of the various connectors. Those tabs are easily bent out of their correct position when inserting the board onto the mother board tray, and I have seen them actually sticking into the connector openings that are large, like USB ports or the network cable port.

The slow boot you described seems to be a long POST process, that happens before Windows starts to load/boot. Do you have the small POST beep speaker connected to the board, and the beep enabled in the BIOS? When POST completes successfully you get a single beep. Also, the Dr Debug display of the POST codes are probably showing POST testing the USB ports, which never completes due to lack of power. Somehow POST continues, which is Ok since the board will still work with dead USB ports.

If you answer my questions and maybe give some more information we can continue trying to discover what is happening.
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jglynn43 View Drop Down
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Points: 19 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jglynn43 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Sep 2015 at 9:28am
Thank you for taking the time to respond to my query.

In both cases it was the USB 3 ports on the IO panel on the rear, but only the Intel ones not the ASMedia 3.0 ports right next to them. The USB 2 port next to the Dr Debug continued to work as did ports connected to the USB 3 header and USB 2 header on the bottom of the board.

The mouse is a standard 2 button scroll-wheel model (Dell branded); nothing fancy.

I suspect the reason for the long POST is that the MB is querying the ports and they never respond. It is also causing long boot times for the OS (Linux, BTW); most likely for the same reason since they still show up using lsusb.

I still have MB #1 so I can check it for burned up surface mount components. They are tiny and I do have a lighted magnifying glass on my workbench but it would be nice to know where to look :-).
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Points: 4996 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote parsec Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Sep 2015 at 11:42am
In general, the fuses will be close to the USB 3.0 ports that are apparently broken.

So if the USB 3.0 ports at the top of the IO panel in the same metal rectangular box as the PC/2 port are bad, then the area on the mother board just behind that box is the place to look. You'll find printing on the board in that area, "USB3_12" for USB 3.0 ports 1 and 2.

Beyond the general area, which is also partially blocked by one VRM heat sink, every board is laid out differently, so it is impossible to be specific. That part of the board has many small parts on it, making it more challenging. If you can read any writing on the board, parts have code letters and numbers to identify them. Fuses should be "Fx", where x is a number, such as "F101". Capacitors are 'C', resistors are 'R', and transistors and integrated circuit chips are 'Q' or "IC".

You could check another area of the board that is less "busy", like the USB headers for the PC case at the bottom of the board. You might be able to find a part marked "Fx", so you'll know what the fuse looks like.

Would I be surprised if Dell had some kind of proprietary mouse connection for their all in one PCs? Sounds crazy but they do that with their PC fans.

If a mouse is blowing USB 3.0 fuses, which have at least three times the power capability of a USB 2.0 port (and only work at USB 1.1 speed BTW), then that puts the mouse on the short list of suspects IMO.
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jglynn43 View Drop Down
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Points: 19 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jglynn43 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Sep 2015 at 12:30pm
The mouse is actually the only common denominator since I tossed the original keyboard after MB #1 blew up (at the time, the mouse was plugged into its extension port). According to the sticker on the bottom, it's 5V 100mA so it should be well within USB 3 spec. Lsusb shows it pulling 98mA right now. Maybe it has an intermittent short. I don't have the equipment to check and nothing looks broken from the outside.

The thing is, after the first failure and I got it to work again on the ASMedia ports or the front panel ones from the header, the mouse and keyboard work. And they worked there for two months on MB #1 until I got a spare $160 to try again. Now I have the same issue with MB #2. Intel USB 3 ports are dead but other than that it works. I'm using it right now.

Of course this does not mean that the mouse is not fubar, but it is odd that only this set of ports keeps breaking. I will definitely be looking at the MB closely this weekend. Gotta get ready for work now. 5 AM comes early :-)
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Points: 1 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote core9 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Nov 2015 at 2:59am
I'm seeing the same issue you are describing jglynn43. Slow boot 20-30 seconds to POST and the non-working USB. I need to inspect the board in more detail and post my findings.
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jglynn43 View Drop Down
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Points: 19 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jglynn43 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Dec 2015 at 1:43am
I wanted to post a followup to this issue. First the usb ports do still have power. On a lark, I plugged my phone into one of the "dead" ports. The device was not recognized but it did charge. 

Secondly, due to an unrelated issue of an unrecognized IDE by the BIOS, I had to reset the CMOS. After 5 or 6 resets to get the IDE drive working, the Dr DOS USB error that I had been seeing was also gone. The formerly non-working USB ports now worked and the boot time was back to 2 seconds.

For about a week. Then it was back to broken and the CMOS reset trick doesn't seem to be working this time. Is there some undocumented factory reset I just happened to stumble on before?
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wardog View Drop Down
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Points: 6447 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wardog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Dec 2015 at 5:38am
Look in Device Manager that you quite possibly have the ubiquitous "Unknown Device" listed please.
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jglynn43 View Drop Down
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Points: 19 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jglynn43 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Dec 2015 at 6:33am
No Windows on this kubuntu box Smile and I'm starting to wonder if that might be part of the problem. Immediately prior to the last failure I had updated my kernel and rebooted. Perhaps the microcode update caused a problem with what was in the CMOS?
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Points: 6447 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wardog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Dec 2015 at 6:31pm
Originally posted by jglynn43 jglynn43 wrote:

No Windows on this kubuntu box Smile and I'm starting to wonder if that might be part of the problem. Immediately prior to the last failure I had updated my kernel and rebooted. Perhaps the microcode update caused a problem with what was in the CMOS?



re: microcode

Have you seen the below:
https://downloadcenter.intel.com/download/25512/Linux-Processor-Microcode-Data-File
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