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AMD Ryzen 1800x CPU thermal throttling

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warman675 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 01 Oct 2017 at 12:23am
As the title says I am building a PC, with that processor and I am having difficulties with temperatures, I can accept that it is very useful the CPU thermal throttling to take care of my processor since it maintains stable temperatures to a maximum of 75°C, but the specifications of the CPU indicate that it can have a maximum of 95°C, it is now well known that the Ryzen processors indicate a temperature 20°C higher than normal, so if my equipment is at 75°C and summed the 20°C, the motherboard believes that it reaches 95°C and protects the processor. And it should be noted that this has a +/- 10% impact on CPU performance. which in theory at 100% yield should reach temperatures around 80°C.
I am currently using the Cryorig C7 http://www.cryorig.com/c7.php
This is due to the limited space I have and its price/availability.
I also have the following motherboard: https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157780

to improve ventilation I will buy a new fan, but even with better ventilation, I will not lower 10°C, is there any way to correct this gap of the sum of 20°C?

Thank you very much!

Edited by warman675 - 01 Oct 2017 at 12:27am
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warman65, please list your system specifications in your signature as I have, including BIOS version.  I suspect you have purchased an insufficient CPU cooler.  I use a Corsair H100i on my 1800X and can run Prime95 as long as I like with temperatures staying below 60C.  The H100i V2 is some cheaper and will probably serve.  I see almost no chance of talking AMD into raising the throttling temperature.  It will just cost them money.  I also see little chance people like me understanding the whole sensor/temperature picture.  I have heard AMD added 20C for 1800X to make it like other models - makes no sense to me.  The only path I see for you is to buy a cooler that is a better cooler and better buy.  I also feel that lower temperatures are always better and hitting the limit repeatedly will ultimately shorten your CPU life.  I always overkill on power supply and CPU cooler.  Good luck and enjoy, John.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wardog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Oct 2017 at 3:50am
Along with MisterJ's ask, please include the rooms ambient temp and idle temp in said room.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote warman675 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Oct 2017 at 10:40am
Originally posted by MisterJ MisterJ wrote:

warman65, please list your system specifications in your signature as I have, including BIOS version.? I suspect you have purchased an insufficient CPU cooler.? I use a Corsair H100i on my 1800X and can run Prime95 as long as I like with temperatures staying below 60C.? The H100i V2 is some cheaper and will probably serve.? I see almost no chance of talking AMD into raising the throttling temperature.? It will just cost them money.? I also see little chance people like me understanding the whole sensor/temperature picture.? I have heard AMD added 20C for 1800X to make it like other models - makes no sense to me.? The only path I see for you is to buy a cooler that is a better cooler and better buy.? I also feel that lower temperatures are always better and hitting the limit repeatedly will ultimately shorten your CPU life.? I always overkill on power supply and CPU cooler.? Good luck and enjoy, John.


Thanks for your answer my system is a Mini Itx system so im very limited with the space.
this is the working computer:


I wish i can fit this one but it's too big for the case:


My system:
CPU: AMD Ryzen 1800x at stock speed.
GPU: Nvidia 1080 ti
RAM: 16GB DDR4 3600MHz
MOBO: Asrock AB350 Gaming-ITX/ac
HDD: 9TB
CPU Cooler: Cryorig C7

And my bios is the last one, a few days ago i updated the bios.
this is the idle temp:

MOBO:

20 min full load:


Inside:


Here is the MOBO Manual:
Manual

And today 13°C
Thanks!

Edited by warman675 - 02 Oct 2017 at 1:23am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TooQik Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2017 at 10:19am
Looking at the picture you've provided of your build, I would hazard a guess that the problem isn't the CPU cooler itself, as the Cryorig C7 is rated for 100W TDP, but rather the case is trapping the hot air inside.

Are you able to provide some details on what case you're using and whether it currently has fans to exhaust the hot air?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote parsec Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2017 at 12:44pm
I would love to see an AMD specification document that shows the maximum temperature of a Ryzen 7 1800X. Or of any Ryzen processor.

There are multiple safety features to protect a processor. Two are built into the processor itself. One is built into the mother board.

Thermal throttling, which is reducing the CPU core speed to stop the CPU temperature from continuing to increase once it reaches a certain temperature, is a safety feature built into the CPU by the manufacture of the CPU. The CPU still operates in this situation, just at a lower core frequency/speed.

If the CPU temperature surpasses a certain maximum allowed temperature, both the mother board and the CPU can turn off the CPU to protect it. Usually the mother board will turn off the CPU before the CPU does it by itself. The PC stops working completely in this situation.

It is not clear to me which type of thermal safety feature is active in your PC. Is it thermal throttling, or does the PC shut off?

The UEFI/BIOS of some mother boards allow you to change the thermal shutdown temperature. I have not seen that feature so far in the UEFI of my ASRock X370 board. There may be a reason for that.

The Cryorig C7 is not as good a CPU cooler as the AMD Wraith coolers are. The C7 is rated in testing to be only a little bit better than the Intel stock CPU cooler, which is considered one of the worst CPU coolers we can use. Current Intel CPUs begin to thermal throttle at ~100° C.

In a very small PC case like yours, using a C7 with virtually no ventilation at all, I'm not surprised your 1800X is reaching 75° C. If we subtracted the 20°C offset of Tctrl from your idle temperature of 34° C, do you really believe your idle temperature is 14° C with a C7?

I don't trust the CAM software, I've read too many bad things about it. At least run the Ryzenmaster software to verify that CAM is correct.

http://www.amd.com/en/technologies/ryzen-master





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote warman675 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2017 at 12:47pm
Originally posted by TooQik TooQik wrote:

[URL=][/URL]Looking at the picture you've provided of your build, I would hazard a guess that the problem isn't the CPU cooler itself, as the Cryorig C7 is rated for 100W TDP, but rather the case is trapping the hot air inside.

Are you able to provide some details on what case you're using and whether it currently has fans to exhaust the hot air?


thanks for your reply, this is my case
SilverStone RAVEN https://www.amazon.com/SilverStone-Technology-Mini-ITX-Computer-RVZ02B/dp/B0161UXXN8/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1506919304&sr=8-4&keywords=SilverStone%2BRAVEN&th=1

for that reason i'll buy a new fan to put in the case.
but even if i leave the case open, the temps are the same. and by the reviews that's are more or less the temps of c7.

Thanks again.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote warman675 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2017 at 1:01pm
Originally posted by parsec parsec wrote:

I would love to see an AMD specification document that shows the maximum temperature of a Ryzen 7 1800X. Or of any Ryzen processor.

There are multiple safety features to protect a processor. Two are built into the processor itself. One is built into the mother board.

Thermal throttling, which is reducing the CPU core speed to stop the CPU temperature from continuing to increase once it reaches a certain temperature, is a safety feature built into the CPU by the manufacture of the CPU. The CPU still operates in this situation, just at a lower core frequency/speed.

If the CPU temperature surpasses a certain maximum allowed temperature, both the mother board and the CPU can turn off the CPU to protect it. Usually the mother board will turn off the CPU before the CPU does it by itself. The PC stops working completely in this situation.

It is not clear to me which type of thermal safety feature is active in your PC. Is it thermal throttling, or does the PC shut off?

The UEFI/BIOS of some mother boards allow you to change the thermal shutdown temperature. I have not seen that feature so far in the UEFI of my ASRock X370 board. There may be a reason for that.

The Cryorig C7 is not as good a CPU cooler as the AMD Wraith coolers are. The C7 is rated in testing to be only a little bit better than the Intel stock CPU cooler, which is considered one of the worst CPU coolers we can use. Current Intel CPUs begin to thermal throttle at ~100° C.

In a very small PC case like yours, using a C7 with virtually no ventilation at all, I'm not surprised your 1800X is reaching 75° C. If we subtracted the 20°C offset of Tctrl from your idle temperature of 34° C, do you really believe your idle temperature is 14° C with a C7?

I don't trust the CAM software, I've read too many bad things about it. At least run the Ryzenmaster software to verify that CAM is correct.

http://www.amd.com/en/technologies/ryzen-master



i see all the temps beatween cam and ryzen master, and are the same, so it shows the real temps, but for the motherboard and the thermal throttling are 20C higher and i cannot see that.

and in old bios there is more commun to see the power off at the temp xx.
here is thermal throttling, there is a menu for that but not for disabling or correct the temps. and if i disable the c states or whatever, nothing happens. just the same thing at 75C.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TooQik Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2017 at 1:23pm
Originally posted by warman675 warman675 wrote:


thanks for your reply, this is my case
SilverStone RAVEN https://www.amazon.com/SilverStone-Technology-Mini-ITX-Computer-RVZ02B/dp/B0161UXXN8/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1506919304&sr=8-4&keywords=SilverStone%2BRAVEN&th=1

for that reason i'll buy a new fan to put in the case.
but even if i leave the case open, the temps are the same. and by the reviews that's are more or less the temps of c7.

Thanks again.


Thanks for the case details.

I've had a look at your case specifications which shows that there are no provisions for exhaust fans so you would have to make modifications to fit a fan to remove the hot air.

In your picture I noticed that you have a hard drive sitting below the CPU. This does not seem to be mounted and from the pictures I've seen of the case would be sitting on one of the passive vents. Is this correct? If so, it might be worth moving this hard drive so it doesn't block the CPU vent and trial the PC laying horizontally to see if this affects the temperatures in any way.

I actually think that this case isn't a good fit for a high end CPU as it only allows for a CPU cooler height of 58 mm and only has passive ducting. If I were going to spend any money on trying to bring down the CPU temperatures I would look at investing in a new case as a first step.


Edited by TooQik - 02 Oct 2017 at 1:25pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote parsec Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2017 at 10:00pm
Originally posted by warman675 warman675 wrote:

Originally posted by parsec parsec wrote:

I would love to see an AMD specification document that shows the maximum temperature of a Ryzen 7 1800X. Or of any Ryzen processor.

There are multiple safety features to protect a processor. Two are built into the processor itself. One is built into the mother board.

Thermal throttling, which is reducing the CPU core speed to stop the CPU temperature from continuing to increase once it reaches a certain temperature, is a safety feature built into the CPU by the manufacture of the CPU. The CPU still operates in this situation, just at a lower core frequency/speed.

If the CPU temperature surpasses a certain maximum allowed temperature, both the mother board and the CPU can turn off the CPU to protect it. Usually the mother board will turn off the CPU before the CPU does it by itself. The PC stops working completely in this situation.

It is not clear to me which type of thermal safety feature is active in your PC. Is it thermal throttling, or does the PC shut off?

The UEFI/BIOS of some mother boards allow you to change the thermal shutdown temperature. I have not seen that feature so far in the UEFI of my ASRock X370 board. There may be a reason for that.

The Cryorig C7 is not as good a CPU cooler as the AMD Wraith coolers are. The C7 is rated in testing to be only a little bit better than the Intel stock CPU cooler, which is considered one of the worst CPU coolers we can use. Current Intel CPUs begin to thermal throttle at ~100° C.

In a very small PC case like yours, using a C7 with virtually no ventilation at all, I'm not surprised your 1800X is reaching 75° C. If we subtracted the 20°C offset of Tctrl from your idle temperature of 34° C, do you really believe your idle temperature is 14° C with a C7?

I don't trust the CAM software, I've read too many bad things about it. At least run the Ryzenmaster software to verify that CAM is correct.

http://www.amd.com/en/technologies/ryzen-master



i see all the temps beatween cam and ryzen master, and are the same, so it shows the real temps, but for the motherboard and the thermal throttling are 20C higher and i cannot see that.

and in old bios there is more commun to see the power off at the temp xx.
here is thermal throttling, there is a menu for that but not for disabling or correct the temps. and if i disable the c states or whatever, nothing happens. just the same thing at 75C.


I'm still not sure what is happening, you said thermal throttling, which is the CPU itself reducing its core speed to reduce its temperature, while the PC still works.

Does the PC shut off, or does it still work when the CPU temperature is 75° C? It seems you have thermal throttling, the core speed is reduced, but the PC still works. Is that right?

C States are a CPU power saving option, which is not related to thermal throttling or thermal shutdown of a CPU. Disabling C States actually causes a CPU to be hotter, since it can't go into a lower power state when it is idle.

Disabling random things in the BIOS won't help you.

I'll check the thermal throttling options in my X370 board.

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